wuzak
Captain
I just spent a few minutes looking for a picture of a clean sheet of paper I could use in here.
Why does the Breda 88 get shit on so much
- Thread starter pops-paolo
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I just spent a few minutes looking for a picture of a clean sheet of paper I could use in here.
Yes by removing the .30 cals, IFF, and nose armor. It would also require us turning this thread into another P-39 thrashing session that will ultimately end up closed…
Cheers,
Biff
PS: My above answer is really an attempt at humor elsewhere on this forum…
Last edited:
Thumpalumpacus
Captain
Are those awards, or armor?!
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
Hey!
How come Buff gets a free pass when he mentions P-39, but I get a time-out when I mentioned it earlier??
It's because he has the dinner plate medal, isn't?
How come Buff gets a free pass when he mentions P-39, but I get a time-out when I mentioned it earlier??
It's because he has the dinner plate medal, isn't?
Shortround6
Major General
A heavy airplane can use either a big wing to fly or big engines (or both).
The Breda 88 had neither. Plus the aerodynamics of a bad steam locomotive.
Wiki can be good and bad. It compared the Breda88 with the Bf 110. The 110 once it gat past the Jumo 210 engine had 10-15% more power than the Breda 88 in 1940 (got even better later) and had a larger wing for the same weight. The engines on the Breda 88 were barn doors.
They were almost identical in diameter to the R-2800s used in many American planes but had 1/2 the power at sea level and only about 60-65% of the power at 4000 meters.
The British Blenheim had lower powered engines but a much bigger wing.
It does look cool at first glance though
The Breda 88 had neither. Plus the aerodynamics of a bad steam locomotive.
Wiki can be good and bad. It compared the Breda88 with the Bf 110. The 110 once it gat past the Jumo 210 engine had 10-15% more power than the Breda 88 in 1940 (got even better later) and had a larger wing for the same weight. The engines on the Breda 88 were barn doors.
They were almost identical in diameter to the R-2800s used in many American planes but had 1/2 the power at sea level and only about 60-65% of the power at 4000 meters.
The British Blenheim had lower powered engines but a much bigger wing.
It does look cool at first glance though
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
Probably armor to protect them from fat-manchild dictator's poison darts...
Thumpalumpacus
Captain
Didn't Biff help sink the Bismarck by flying off the Ark Royal in a P-39 and torpedoing its rudder?
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
It does look cool at first glance though
At first glance - but the more I look at it, the more it reminds me of a flying Cannoli!
Thumpalumpacus
Captain
I can hear the plinkplinkplink from here.
Maybe that's why N. Korea switched the AA for some executions .
Skyediamonds
Staff Sergeant
- 1,083
- May 26, 2018
Gentlemen:
I read every single mind-numbing post & I believe what's being overlooked is Pops Paolo is Italian, has openly admitted his lack of aerodynamics, but feels a tug a of patriotism towards his country. He sees what appears to be a muscular aircraft that; just by going strictly on appearance is fast & a good military aircraft. Yet he reads the reports that reveals the harsh reality of the aircraft performance & these reports conflicts what the photos shows to be a sleek & beautiful design. I believe he's trying to rectify what he sees is a beautiful aircraft with the less-than complimentary assessments of its function. Meaning? If it looks good......
As a licensed private pilot with multi-engine rating, A&P mechanic, ( retired ) certified inspector for P&W PT-6 & JT-8 turboprop & jet engines, & blah, blah.. I can relate to all of the analysis of the pros & cons of the Breda 88. And yet through Pop's eyes, I too, see what appears to be an Italian aircraft variant of the famous Italian sports cars ( pick one).
As an active modeler (see my current super detailed Guillow's Mustang build) I too see a rare but beautiful subject to be modeled. I have even attempted considering to modeling this aircraft.
Performance? It yeah it's sucks. For appearance? I see a beefy looking sleek twin engined aircraft that says "Italian" with pride.
Cheers to you Pops. Hoping when you get a chance to visit Italy this year, you may visit some of the air museums & enjoy many aircraft of Italian design that stood with pride, starting with the Savoia M-65 racer & culminating in the world record setting MC-72 to the Atlantic crossing in formation of Balbo's M-55 & many more.
Cheers,
I read every single mind-numbing post & I believe what's being overlooked is Pops Paolo is Italian, has openly admitted his lack of aerodynamics, but feels a tug a of patriotism towards his country. He sees what appears to be a muscular aircraft that; just by going strictly on appearance is fast & a good military aircraft. Yet he reads the reports that reveals the harsh reality of the aircraft performance & these reports conflicts what the photos shows to be a sleek & beautiful design. I believe he's trying to rectify what he sees is a beautiful aircraft with the less-than complimentary assessments of its function. Meaning? If it looks good......
As a licensed private pilot with multi-engine rating, A&P mechanic, ( retired ) certified inspector for P&W PT-6 & JT-8 turboprop & jet engines, & blah, blah.. I can relate to all of the analysis of the pros & cons of the Breda 88. And yet through Pop's eyes, I too, see what appears to be an Italian aircraft variant of the famous Italian sports cars ( pick one).
As an active modeler (see my current super detailed Guillow's Mustang build) I too see a rare but beautiful subject to be modeled. I have even attempted considering to modeling this aircraft.
Performance? It yeah it's sucks. For appearance? I see a beefy looking sleek twin engined aircraft that says "Italian" with pride.
Cheers to you Pops. Hoping when you get a chance to visit Italy this year, you may visit some of the air museums & enjoy many aircraft of Italian design that stood with pride, starting with the Savoia M-65 racer & culminating in the world record setting MC-72 to the Atlantic crossing in formation of Balbo's M-55 & many more.
Cheers,
GrauGeist
Generalfeldmarschall zur Luftschiff Abteilung
While I agree that the Lynx looked good to a certain extent, the bulbous semi-bomb bay extension ruins the lines for me.
Why not instead, look to the Savoia-Marchetti SM.91 for a sleek looking machine and one that could have had real potential in another lifetime?
Why not instead, look to the Savoia-Marchetti SM.91 for a sleek looking machine and one that could have had real potential in another lifetime?
Getting your S's and M's mixed up there, skyediamonds, inhaling that jet fuel when servicing those PT6s and JT8s...
Savoia S.65, or Macchi M.67...
MC.72...
And Balbo's S.55s.
I'd love to see one of these in person. There's a complete one in a museum in Brazil, but it's been closed to the public for a few years now since before COVID.
Lots more. Images from my 2019 visit to the Italian Air Force Museum on the shore of Lake Bracchiano.
Museo Storica Dell'Aeronautico Militare | Flickr
Skyediamonds
Staff Sergeant
- 1,083
- May 26, 2018
Nuuuu:
Thank you. I stand corrected. Must've been just a tad bit of jet fuel......
Thank you. I stand corrected. Must've been just a tad bit of jet fuel......
keithwwalker
Airman
- 38
- Jan 27, 2014
Three reasons it failed:
Curtiss A-18
Breguet 690, 693
Blenheim
Hs-129
- Lack of HP
- A high wing loading aircraft design, in an air force that craved low wing loading fighters & low landing speeds - RAF, US, Luftwaffe all went through that transition, the Italians did not
- The fuselage AND wing had the skin of a monocoque, but a full tubular fuselage as well.
Curtiss A-18
Breguet 690, 693
Blenheim
Hs-129
PSA: Don't forget to tip the help!
Skyediamonds
Staff Sergeant
- 1,083
- May 26, 2018
Don't forget the Messerschmitt Me-110 wasn't exactly a Gold star twin.
But at least the Bf 110 was able to be used successfully in secondary roles such as a night fighter.
Admiral Beez
Captain
Which always surprised me that the Japanese army and navy air services did not have a larger pipeline of aircraft mechanic/maintenance personnel.
- Thread starter
- #140
pops-paolo
I will love England forever despite Euro 2020!
both engines had the same power, same weight, the bf110 was slightly faster, the bf110 was slightly bigger
