Best Fighter

[evangilder]

Agreed NS. It was a happy day for the family when they cut the yellow ribbon off the tree at my aunt and uncle's house on my cousins arrival home. He spent more that a year there and we wrote him regularly, even though we only heard back sporadically. No matter the circumstances behind the deployments, our guys will ALWAYS have my support, and I am relatively sure that Les feels the same.

 

[Erich]

Personally I voted for Herr Bush only because I wanted him in to continue the struggle we are in and will get ever deeper..............he seems strong enough to handle the situation as long as congress doesn't patsy around, but that was just the case when we were in Nam and didn't let us do the job..........

Kerry is a fool and a traitor as I know this from Nam.

we have our guys seeking out "items" in Iran, Syria and Lebanon and elsewhere such as North Korea, so typically to me it doesn't really matter who is president as long as they do not live the lie. wonder though how Amerika will react when Mrs' Clinton gets into power in 2008. time for a baking party with Martha Stewert ? geez

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I'm with you Les. I wasn't crazy about Bush, but less crazy about Kerry. Lesser of 2 evils, or who you dislike less. The problem is that both parties have moved so far from the center, which is where most people are (the center). You end up with a really polarized race and no one else wins. It sucks.

I sometimes think that us veterans should form our own party. One, most of us have been to foreign countries and seen them and how the real people live. Secondly, we have seen the blood and guts, smelled the cordite, and the fear. WE know better than most of the Washington assholes when it's time to do some ass-kicking, and we can do it right, without all the politically correct crap and then get the guys home. Instead of taking a knife to a gunfight, take a nuke to a fistfight!! Throw EVERYTHING at them. The next two-bit pissant third world s**t dictator will think twice after watching one of his friends get seriously jacked up.

Okay, stepping off the soapbox here. Sometimes I get a little fired up.

I could not agree with you more fully. We do need to make our own party. We are working class people who lay our lives on the line and pay the ultimate sacrifice (THOU SHALT NOT BE FORGOTTEN). We have seen how the people live in other countries. We truely understand what is going on out there. I believe that the Iraq situation would be much better if the damn assholes who call themselves politicians would but out and let us military people handle it. All the politicians do is make the situation worse. My favorite is how they tell the press that the moral is great over here, they need to come over here and see how low the moral is. Why is the moral so low not so much because we are away from our families, but because our hands are tied behind our backs. Everyday I fly dead soldiers on there final trip home and why did they die because they could not defend themselves! If you do not see the "smoking gun" you can not fight back. We go into cities and rid them of the insurgents and then pull out and let them right back in. We can not go into religious areas because the poloticians want to win there hearts and minds but that is where the bad guys go to the religious areas since we cant them. We are fighting this war with our hands tied behind our backs.

Secondly I believe that a requirement to be President is that you have served in the armed forces and not as a reservist who did not show up for duty because they went campaining or a draft dodger. You can not send young men and women to die unless you too have faced the dangers taht you are sending them into. They sit there on Christmas and tell the people how they want to thank us for our sacrifices and understand how it feels to be away from our families when they never served and are sitting there with there families enjoying Christmas dinner. They can all kiss my ass. I hate them all.

Allright I am going to stop now, I am getting carried away and now just ranting on my personal beliefs of polotics and I hate polotics. Sorry about my rant guys, but it feels good to get it out.

 

[evangilder]

Adler, of all the people here, you have the most right to vent, my friend. You're out there on the lines and see and hear what we never see or hear from the press. You make us proud.

 

[Nonskimmer]

Don't worry about the rant, man. If anyone is entitled to it, it's you. Rant away if you wish.
I for one wish you the very best of luck, and I admire you for what you're doing: putting your ass on the line, in the service of your country.

Now just make it home safe!

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Thank you very much you know what my favorite was? Rumsfeld (I really dont like this guy) came to Iraq on Christmas eve and he said he wanted to visit the troops and tell us what a good job we are doing and since we cant be home with our family's he was going to spend Christmas eve with us. 7 hours later he got on a plane and went back to Washington and with the time zones and everything he never missed it with his family. I dont know anything about his prior military service but I dont think he did much but he claims to be gods greatest gift to the US military. All I have seen him do is medle in our affairs and screw it all up!

 

[Erich]

Adler, soldier and friend your correlation is the same as mine back in 1970's..........although my capacity was something a bit different. Yes we were bound, and we sacked out like a bunch of scattered rats. Hanoi should of been flattened and we had the means to do so........

what do you think you should be doing since our government has tied your hands ? just want your honest opinion as a dedicated serviceman serving our country

v/r

Erich ~ one target, one bullet

 

[evangilder]

Nice pic Adler! That's you on the left, correct?

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Adler, soldier and friend your correlation is the same as mine back in 1970's..........although my capacity was something a bit different. Yes we were bound, and we sacked out like a bunch of scattered rats. Hanoi should of been flattened and we had the means to do so........

what do you think you should be doing since our government has tied your hands ? just want your honest opinion as a dedicated serviceman serving our country

v/r

Erich ~ one target, one bullet

You are absolutly correct Erich. This is my generations Vietnam. And we are paying the price for policians blunders. To be honest what I think we should do, and this really does go against my principles because I do not believe in harming innocent women and children but the enemy is hiding out in these towns and villages and the population of the towns knows this and knows that they are there. When an attack happens in one of the towns it should be flattened completely destroyed and nothing remains. After this happens a few times people might start turning them over or atleast telling us and warning us of there wereabouts.. I believe that when I find someone setting up a road side bomb, rather than detain him and bring him to prison he should be shot on the spot and his body left there for all to see. The best weapon is fear and all these people know is fear. When you try and be nice to them they kill you. When we engage we are to use the minimum force necessary so as not to kill, screw that if he is dead he can not kill some one later. I think we need to stop being so friendly and if we are going to fight a war the government needs to let us fight this war the way it needs to be done. The problem is these people kill each other too. It is a situation that is similar to Bosnia, Croatia, and Kosovo in there war with Serbia in the mid 90's. They have no regard to human life and take it at will, if they do not want our help then we need to leave (which we can not do because we have to finish what we started) or the government needs to allow us to fight a war with every means possible instead of letting us get slaughtered like rats as you say.

Nice pic Adler! That's you on the left, correct?

Thank you yes I am the one on the left. My unit has been flying flags all over Iraq especially to Tikrit and Baghdad and back and sending them back to people in the states. We take a photo of the flag being held by the crew after the mission and print up a certificate stating where it went to and signed by the crew. If anyone would like to have one if you send me your address in a private message I can try and get a couple of more flags (they are selling out like crazy at the px, everyone buys one and gives us flags to fly for there family back home) and fly one and send it to you.

 

[evangilder]

Adler, I totally agree with you. Unfortunately, there is too much of that touchy feely crap in government and they are so averse to offending anyone. There are exceptions. I got this one sent to me the other day and I loved it:
City Councilman ejected from studio

T. Bubba Bechtol, part time City Councilman from Midland, TX, was asked on a local live radio talk show the other day just what he thought of the allegations of torture of the Iraqi prisoners. His reply prompted his ejection from the studio, but to thunderous applause from the audience.

"If hooking up an Iraqi prisoner's scrotum to a car's battery cables will save one American GI's life, then I have just two things to say":

"Red is positive"
"Black is negative"


I couldn't agree more.

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

wow you don't look how i thought you would.............

 

[Erich]

Adler thank you for your reply. I apologize for my direct question to you as it was off topic. It should of been done in a private.

be on your guard friend. I found in my past it was best to always be on the move not allowing others to pick you out. Trust no-one !

one target, one bullet

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

wow you don't look how i thought you would.............

LOL, How am I supposed to look?

 

[the lancaster kicks ass]

not like that................

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I find that funny.

 

[Nonskimmer]

City Councilman ejected from studio

T. Bubba Bechtol, part time City Councilman from Midland, TX, was asked on a local live radio talk show the other day just what he thought of the allegations of torture of the Iraqi prisoners. His reply prompted his ejection from the studio, but to thunderous applause from the audience.

"If hooking up an Iraqi prisoner's scrotum to a car's battery cables will save one American GI's life, then I have just two things to say":

"Red is positive"
"Black is negative"


I couldn't agree more.

8) 8)

 

[plan_D]

Haha. Brilliant...I couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[Udet]

Hello Der Adler!

You made several strong points in your comments.

As you can see people, Der Adler is experiencing himself many of the things the German soldiers experienced throughout the countries Germany attacked and occupied.

Has any of you ever read a book from an individual named Omer Bertov, where he speaks of the German invasion of the USSR and the "barbarization of warfare"?

The book is mainly bunk, depicting absolutely all the German soldiers, officers and commanders as terrorific demons whose blood lust could not be ever satisfied; remorseless beasts, so the author says.

The opposite side of the coin is the soviet population of the areas where the Wehrmacht operated: they were all inoccent harmless hummingbirds simply exercising their holy sacred divine right of defending their homeland.

The German soldiers had no right to defend themselves from partisan attacks or after being ambushed by people wearing no military uniform: whenever they did, in a powerful reaction, the Germans were "criminals".

Do you realize how easy is for virtually any individual to approach the war in such a manner the serves his personal agenda?

Today, the USA is the attacker and invader. That the reasons Hitler had for launching Barbarossa are completely different to those the USA had to invade Irak in this century, might be true, but in the end the scenario is virtually the same. It is not my point to get further into silly details of comparing Barbarossa with the military invasion of the USA in Irak.

The fact is the world sees a foreign army occupying an independent nation where a big number of its inhabitants do not like the invaders; many of them will pick whatever weapon they can to kill as many invaders as possible.

Der Adler makes a strong point when he says you can not be gentle and nice with the people of the invaded country: many of them will be glad to kill you if they have the chance, so imposing fear becomes compulsory. You do not have time to detect with accuracy which ones are likely to be friendly from those who are to be hostile.

You assume all of them are your enemies. Is this what you are trying to point out Der Adler?

In many places, many German officers and soldiers applied the principle Der Adler is poiting here, and for that the Wehrmacht was put in trial and copped out as "tool for genocide"; a ruddy ridiculous verdict, laughable.

If the leaders of one nation decide to go to war it shall be assumed they are aware of the consequences of such a tremendous decision. All wars have brutality attached to them. I am sure many soldiers of the USA have committed acts of brutality against inoccent iraki civilians -the scandal of the abuses on Iraqi POWs conducted by the red neck punks the USA Army brought in to take care of the prisons would be a joke- , in one level or another, and such acts will continue to happen for as long as the USA army stays in Irak.

Violence of course brings more violence. The violence applied by the side keeping the upper hand (USA) can certainly help for a while, but the problem will certainly continue to be there, and the violence of the subjugated side (people of Irak) will certainly rose to the surface sooner or later.

All soldiers have all my respect and admiration; in the end they are the ones paying the high cost of the decisions of the lunatics in power.

Der Adler, i tell you all this with all due respect, and again, admiration. I wish you the best and that soon you can get out of there and make it home safe; there must be some people waiting for you.

Cheers!

 

[Anonymous]

I wish I had time to reply in this thread.... but it will have to wait till the weekend.

=S=

Lunatic

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Hello Der Adler!

You made several strong points in your comments.

As you can see people, Der Adler is experiencing himself many of the things the German soldiers experienced throughout the countries Germany attacked and occupied.

Has any of you ever read a book from an individual named Omer Bertov, where he speaks of the German invasion of the USSR and the "barbarization of warfare"?

The book is mainly bunk, depicting absolutely all the German soldiers, officers and commanders as terrorific demons whose blood lust could not be ever satisfied; remorseless beasts, so the author says.

The opposite side of the coin is the soviet population of the areas where the Wehrmacht operated: they were all inoccent harmless hummingbirds simply exercising their holy sacred divine right of defending their homeland.

The German soldiers had no right to defend themselves from partisan attacks or after being ambushed by people wearing no military uniform: whenever they did, in a powerful reaction, the Germans were "criminals".

Do you realize how easy is for virtually any individual to approach the war in such a manner the serves his personal agenda?

Today, the USA is the attacker and invader. That the reasons Hitler had for launching Barbarossa are completely different to those the USA had to invade Irak in this century, might be true, but in the end the scenario is virtually the same. It is not my point to get further into silly details of comparing Barbarossa with the military invasion of the USA in Irak.

The fact is the world sees a foreign army occupying an independent nation where a big number of its inhabitants do not like the invaders; many of them will pick whatever weapon they can to kill as many invaders as possible.

Der Adler makes a strong point when he says you can not be gentle and nice with the people of the invaded country: many of them will be glad to kill you if they have the chance, so imposing fear becomes compulsory. You do not have time to detect with accuracy which ones are likely to be friendly from those who are to be hostile.

You assume all of them are your enemies. Is this what you are trying to point out Der Adler?

In many places, many German officers and soldiers applied the principle Der Adler is poiting here, and for that the Wehrmacht was put in trial and copped out as "tool for genocide"; a ruddy ridiculous verdict, laughable.

If the leaders of one nation decide to go to war it shall be assumed they are aware of the consequences of such a tremendous decision. All wars have brutality attached to them. I am sure many soldiers of the USA have committed acts of brutality against inoccent iraki civilians -the scandal of the abuses on Iraqi POWs conducted by the red neck punks the USA Army brought in to take care of the prisons would be a joke- , in one level or another, and such acts will continue to happen for as long as the USA army stays in Irak.

Violence of course brings more violence. The violence applied by the side keeping the upper hand (USA) can certainly help for a while, but the problem will certainly continue to be there, and the violence of the subjugated side (people of Irak) will certainly rose to the surface sooner or later.

All soldiers have all my respect and admiration; in the end they are the ones paying the high cost of the decisions of the lunatics in power.

Der Adler, i tell you all this with all due respect, and again, admiration. I wish you the best and that soon you can get out of there and make it home safe; there must be some people waiting for you.

Cheers!

I am sorry Udet, but that was not my point at all. Killing innocent women and children is not something that I want to do and as I said it is against my principle. All I was saying that inorder to fight fire you have to fight fire with fire. Defending yourself from insurgent attacks is not genocide you can not compare them.

Also you can not compare what we are doing right now to the invasion of Russia. We did not come here to take the land away from the Iraqis. We did not come here to take there natural resources. So please with all do respect do not compare Iraq to Operation Barbarossa or any thing that went on in WW2.

I will agree with you that the vast majority of soldiers had nothing to do with any attrocities that were committed in WW2 however you can not make them all out to be saints. Terrible things were committed by many soldiers, also by the Russians themselves. But you can not justify the action as a whole.