Spitfire vs Mustang

[Oskar the Pilot]

Hello everyone, this is my first post! I thought I'd better start by posting something that we all want to know; which was the better dogfighter, the truly British Spit, or the all American Mustang? Posts like this have been done before, but I'm curious for the true answer.

Okay, let's assume it's a Spitfire Mk XIV we're talking about, against a say, P-51D Mustang. Which would come out on top in a dogfight? The winner of this poll will be the true dogfight champion in my eyes.


Let the poll begin!

-Oskar


Edit: The winner will be in a poll against the Japanese Zeke.

-=PLEASE VOTE IF YOU REPLY TO THIS THREAD=-

 

[Juha]

Hello
as a dogfighter or an interceptor Mk XIV was superior, Mustang's forte was its range and aerodynamical efficiency which gave it to its speed, acceleration and dive characteristics. I'd say that even slower Spitfire Mk IXs and VIIIs would have been difficult opponents to Mustangs even if Mustang had the speed and dive advantages vs Mk IX/VIII turn and climb advantages.

Juha

 

[Njaco]

....the truly British Spit, or the all American Mustang....

oh no.......

I thought the Mustang had a British engine?

 

[davparlr]

Up to 15-20k ft performance in climb and speed are roughly equivalent between the P-51D and the Spit XIV. Performance of the P-51B is slightly better than the P-51D. Above 20k the Spitfire has a definite advantage.

However, the P-51 could engage in the fight at a much greater distance or for longer period of time.

 

[RCAFson]

For the 31 FG, March would be the last month flying Spitfires. On the 11th, Colonel McCorkle and Lieutenant Meador brought in the first two P-51B aircraft. During a mock dogfight over the field on the 14th, Colonel McCorkel in a P-51 paired up against Lieutenant Williams in a Spitfire IX. The Spitfire completely outmaneuvered the new Mustang.

REPORT NUMBER 88-0500

HISTORY OF USAAF SPITFIRE OPERATIONS IN THE MEDITERRANEAN (31st AND 52nd FIGHTER GROUPS)

by MAJOR CLIFFORD H. CHANDLER, JR., USAF

 

[Juha]

Up to 15-20k ft performance in climb and speed are roughly equivalent between the P-51D and the Spit XIV. Performance of the P-51B is slightly better than the P-51D. Above 20k the Spitfire has a definite advantage...

Difficult to believe and British comparation trials gave to Spitfire Mk IX and XIV better climb performance than to Mustang III (P-51B/C). Soviets seemed to agree. And because of Spitfires had smaller empty weights (also smaller t/o weights but in empty weights the bigger fuel load of P-51 doesn't have influence), lighter wing loadings and Spit IXs and VIIIs more or less same power and XIV more power, so its easy to believe those tests.

On range there was no contest, Mustang was so superior to Spit Mk IX and XIV and clearly longer legged than even Spit Mk VIII.

Juha

 

[Njaco]

So I guess the question should be which mark of Spit would match the 51D?

 

[stona]

The question was specifically which was the better dogfighter. The answer to that particular question is the Spitfire.
Some of you are trying to decide which was the better aircraft overall. That is a much more difficult question and dependant on many more factors.
Cheers
Steve

 

[Readie]

The question was specifically which was the better dogfighter. The answer to that particular question is the Spitfire.
Some of you are trying to decide which was the better aircraft overall. That is a much more difficult question and dependant on many more factors.
Cheers
Steve

That's right Steve. The Spitfire was designed as an interceptor dog fighter from the out set. The Mustang was designed for another role. I think that you cannot really say which one was 'best'. The Mustang should really be compared with other 'long range fighters'.
John

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

As a dogfighter, I would have to go with Spitfire. Of course I am sure (as when comparing all aircraft), it would depend on what conditions such as altitude, speed, etc. Overall my personal opinion however would give this to the Spitfire.

What aircraft would I rather have though? P-51D. Overall I think it was a better aircraft, mostly because it had the range to do what the Spitfire could not, and that is take the fight to the enemy deep in their own territory. Of course this is still apples to oranges, because the Spitfire is an interceptor and the Mustang is a long range escort.

 

[Messy1]

I have flown both on simulators so I am familiar with their characteristics......
Sorry could not resist~

 

[drgondog]

Depends on whether you want to dogfight over Berlin, Stettin, Munich (or Tokyo) versus over London, Paris or Amsterdam.

 

[renrich]

Kind of like comparing a quarter horse and a thoroughbred. They were meant for different tasks. However, the Mustang (plane) was very credible in ACM. The Spitfire could not be a long range escort.

 

[pbfoot]

I know one guy that flew both operationally and the Spitfire was a far better dogfighter that couldn't go to Berlin

 

[drgondog]

I do also - Flt Lt Warren Peglar had 290 combat missions in combined Spit IX, Tempest, 42 missions in a Mustang. Was and exchange pilot from RCAF to 355th FG late July through mid September.

4 air to air kills in P-51, 1 ground. 4 Ground in Tempest, zero air. Zero air, zero ground in Mk IX. preferred MkIX for manueverabilty, Mustang for lethality.

 

[pbfoot]

My source is Charley Fox a 4 confirmed and a couple damaged and lots of rolling stock including Rommel flew the P51 as a reserve pilot post war

 

[Oskar the Pilot]

Woah, you guys actually replied to my post! Thanks for giving me a friendly welcome to the forums!

Enjoying it already

 

[stona]

Depends on whether you want to dogfight over Berlin, Stettin, Munich (or Tokyo) versus over London, Paris or Amsterdam.

Not really,a dogfight is a dogfight and I'll take the Spifire for that. Whether the Spitfire could actually get to the dogfight is a different question!
If the question had been "which of these two aircraft was the better long range escort?" then the answer would have been the P-51.
Cheers
Steve

 

[drgondog]

Not really,a dogfight is a dogfight and I'll take the Spifire for that. Whether the Spitfire could actually get to the dogfight is a different question!
If the question had been "which of these two aircraft was the better long range escort?" then the answer would have been the P-51.
Cheers
Steve

Not really Steve - the question, while rheorical, was about the best dogfighter if both had to fly from UK to Berlin.. escort was a role/mission, and included dogfighting, killing from ambush, strafing, etc. The Mustang wasn't designed as an 'escort' fighter, it was designed as a fighter and evolved to suit a variety of missions including interceptor, long range escort, close air support. Its exceptional range enabled it to do those roles far away.

 

[Messy1]

I do also - Flt Lt Warren Peglar had 290 combat missions in combined Spit IX, Tempest, 42 missions in a Mustang. Was and exchange pilot from RCAF to 355th FG late July through mid September.

4 air to air kills in P-51, 1 ground. 4 Ground in Tempest, zero air. Zero air, zero ground in Mk IX. preferred MkIX for manueverabilty, Mustang for lethality.

By lethality are you referring to firepower Bill?