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Major General
Hmmmmmmmmm....
Submarine hunters
- Thread starter mosquitoman
- Start date
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Gemhorse
Senior Airman
Prior to WWII, a Japanese delegation was in England and was shown through the Short Bros. factories....this did eventually lead to the 'Mavis' seaplane, in fact they also went through Supermarine too, because the 'Emily' was also a product of Japanese observation of other country's manufacturing prowess and products...- I don't have the book on hand now, it was a library one, but I have read about this, LG....
They have an adept ability, do the Japanese, to observe, even acquire, and copy, virtually anything....- As I've posted before, they learned the American tactics to attack Pearl Harbour, from US Naval exercises in 1933, and that also gave them the naval Aircraft-Carrier, which they used to such great effect, something Germany never really cottoned-on to...
Their Industrial strength and savvy was again illustrated in the post-war era, when they were allowed to re-generate their Business and Industry, and take-on manufacturing giants like the US, particuarly with their cars and motorcycles, and in virtually all industries, especially electronics....
Anyway......
Further to my post on the first page, the U-boat that apparently landed here in New Zealand in 1944, was carrying a Nazi War Criminal, his wife and 3 children...Also, they allegedly had, plundered Nazi gold, jewellery and paintings...this was endorsed on the TV program, by a Leo Orphan, who was with British Intelligence...
I haven't as yet discovered the U-boat's serial No., there are apparently 55 U-boats still unaccounted for, but there may be a connection here to U-862, which is noted for action in the Indian Ocean, and for shooting-down a P-38 in Singapore Harbour during the War.- U-862 was known to have been re-fuelled by a mothership in Antartic waters, was sighted in Napier Harbour [a city on the East coast of NZ's North Island,] and then again in Aussie's Sydney Harbour...- Since the U-boats tended to operate in groups, this may have been a Southern Hemisphere Group, operating against the Allies in the Pacific area, as it is well known they had some successes in Australasian waters...- This one that landed in NZ is apparently in 5-6 fathoms deep, parallel to the shore, but just out off the breakwater line, and quite a difficult spot to get-to. The chap whose hunting it, his father was originally into or aware of the whole business, but the TV Channel covering-it has indicated we'll all be kept posted about developments....this is all I've been able to find-out since my first post........Can anyone gain any leads from this ????......
They have an adept ability, do the Japanese, to observe, even acquire, and copy, virtually anything....- As I've posted before, they learned the American tactics to attack Pearl Harbour, from US Naval exercises in 1933, and that also gave them the naval Aircraft-Carrier, which they used to such great effect, something Germany never really cottoned-on to...
Their Industrial strength and savvy was again illustrated in the post-war era, when they were allowed to re-generate their Business and Industry, and take-on manufacturing giants like the US, particuarly with their cars and motorcycles, and in virtually all industries, especially electronics....
Anyway......
Further to my post on the first page, the U-boat that apparently landed here in New Zealand in 1944, was carrying a Nazi War Criminal, his wife and 3 children...Also, they allegedly had, plundered Nazi gold, jewellery and paintings...this was endorsed on the TV program, by a Leo Orphan, who was with British Intelligence...
I haven't as yet discovered the U-boat's serial No., there are apparently 55 U-boats still unaccounted for, but there may be a connection here to U-862, which is noted for action in the Indian Ocean, and for shooting-down a P-38 in Singapore Harbour during the War.- U-862 was known to have been re-fuelled by a mothership in Antartic waters, was sighted in Napier Harbour [a city on the East coast of NZ's North Island,] and then again in Aussie's Sydney Harbour...- Since the U-boats tended to operate in groups, this may have been a Southern Hemisphere Group, operating against the Allies in the Pacific area, as it is well known they had some successes in Australasian waters...- This one that landed in NZ is apparently in 5-6 fathoms deep, parallel to the shore, but just out off the breakwater line, and quite a difficult spot to get-to. The chap whose hunting it, his father was originally into or aware of the whole business, but the TV Channel covering-it has indicated we'll all be kept posted about developments....this is all I've been able to find-out since my first post........Can anyone gain any leads from this ????......
Attachments
Gemhorse, the Japanese learned of the effectiveness of an attack on a harbour from the British Swordfish raid on Taranto. Yamamotos chief of staff was present at the time of the raid...
This U-Boat story is getting really interesting. I watched a programme on nothing to do with U-Boats yesterday, but it was to do with raiders of the Kriegsmarine. Merchant vessels with guns covered, would show themselves as a certain ship that would be in the area then attack when getting close. They had amazing success, and one (Atlantis) captured a report on British positions in Asia. Which lead to the sudden strike of the Japanese against Singapore.
In the report it had said that if the Japanese realise how weak Britain really is in the Pacific they will take advantage straight away...
...I just felt like telling that little story.
This U-Boat story is getting really interesting. I watched a programme on nothing to do with U-Boats yesterday, but it was to do with raiders of the Kriegsmarine. Merchant vessels with guns covered, would show themselves as a certain ship that would be in the area then attack when getting close. They had amazing success, and one (Atlantis) captured a report on British positions in Asia. Which lead to the sudden strike of the Japanese against Singapore.
In the report it had said that if the Japanese realise how weak Britain really is in the Pacific they will take advantage straight away...
...I just felt like telling that little story.
Erich
the old Sage
U-862 - Type IXD2
Laid Down - 15 Aug, 1942
Commissioned - 7 Oct, 1943
Commander - KrvKpt. Heinrich Timm (Knights Cross)
Career - 2 Patrols
Kills - 7 Ships, total of 42.374 tons
Became IJN I502 when captured at Singapore on 6th May 1945, laid down as I502 on the 15th July 1945. Scuttled 13 Feb, 1946.
Also downed a RAF Catalina Sqn. 265/H
Laid Down - 15 Aug, 1942
Commissioned - 7 Oct, 1943
Commander - KrvKpt. Heinrich Timm (Knights Cross)
Career - 2 Patrols
Kills - 7 Ships, total of 42.374 tons
Became IJN I502 when captured at Singapore on 6th May 1945, laid down as I502 on the 15th July 1945. Scuttled 13 Feb, 1946.
Also downed a RAF Catalina Sqn. 265/H
Just for the success for aircraft against U-Boats.
http://www.uboat.net/history/aircraft_losses.htm?sortby=squadron
Erich
the old Sage
the U-boot pic is of U-849 being sunk by a PBY Liberator
Erich
the old Sage
the lancaster kicks ass
Major General
- 19,937
- Dec 20, 2003
very nice pics............
Lightning Guy
Master Sergeant
- 2,511
- Apr 29, 2004
The Bogue was the most successful of the Jeep carriers in terms of hunting U-Boats wasn't it?
- Thread starter
- #91
mosquitoman
Master Sergeant
Yes it was, I've just been reading up on it, a total of 12 submarines (10 German, 1 ex-German used by IJN and one Japanese). Not a bad haul really
Lightning Guy
Master Sergeant
- 2,511
- Apr 29, 2004
Certainly not a bad haul for a converted merchant ship.
Gemhorse
Senior Airman
I read about this Pearl Harbour thing years ago, written by Edwin Muller, entitled '' Blueprint for Pearl Harbour '', published in a Readers Digest...
At the time, an Admiral H.E. Yarnell was out on the Saratoga, and it was in company with the Lexington and 4 destroyers as a task force to try out the Harbour's defences, which he did with 152 aircraft at around dawn 7th Feb. 1932.....it was the Japanese spy organisation on Oahu and in sampans that sent the info back to Tokyo for analysis...they concluded at that point that the primary weapon of a modern navy is Air power and that the Striking force of a fleet should be based around the carriers...as did the US, as they realised bitterly on the 8th Dec. 1941, exactly how, from nine years previous, the Japanese had done it....they'd used exactly the same number of aircraft, and their losses were about the same as Admiral Yarnell's theoretical ones........
Those German merchant raiders were active down in the Pacific, there was one in particular, can't remember the name offhand, but it had quite a ' field day ', really capitalised on it's 'commercial camoflage and disguises'....
Thanks for the details on U-862, plan_D... - It was recorded in that book on 'Aircraft vs U-boats', by Norman Franks, that it shot the P-38 down in Singapore Harbour, which sounds quite unusual....they weren't known for sub-hunting, were they ?? ...and the U-862 was captured there too....?...I'm still wondering if it was part of a Hunting-group with this one that apparently landed here........
And I agree, really awesome U-boat pics, Erich....
At the time, an Admiral H.E. Yarnell was out on the Saratoga, and it was in company with the Lexington and 4 destroyers as a task force to try out the Harbour's defences, which he did with 152 aircraft at around dawn 7th Feb. 1932.....it was the Japanese spy organisation on Oahu and in sampans that sent the info back to Tokyo for analysis...they concluded at that point that the primary weapon of a modern navy is Air power and that the Striking force of a fleet should be based around the carriers...as did the US, as they realised bitterly on the 8th Dec. 1941, exactly how, from nine years previous, the Japanese had done it....they'd used exactly the same number of aircraft, and their losses were about the same as Admiral Yarnell's theoretical ones........
Those German merchant raiders were active down in the Pacific, there was one in particular, can't remember the name offhand, but it had quite a ' field day ', really capitalised on it's 'commercial camoflage and disguises'....
Thanks for the details on U-862, plan_D... - It was recorded in that book on 'Aircraft vs U-boats', by Norman Franks, that it shot the P-38 down in Singapore Harbour, which sounds quite unusual....they weren't known for sub-hunting, were they ?? ...and the U-862 was captured there too....?...I'm still wondering if it was part of a Hunting-group with this one that apparently landed here........
And I agree, really awesome U-boat pics, Erich....
Attachments
lesofprimus
Brigadier General
Excellent pics..
Erich
the old Sage
Crazy
Senior Airman
Does anyone have the number of U-boats built compared to the number left after the war ended? I read them somewhere, but can't find where anymore. It was some incredible number, like 80-85% sunk and more damaged
Erich
the old Sage
Gem: not sure which of the 11 Aux. Schiffe you are talking about in the Pacific, the Orion which scored all but 2 kills in the Pacific and the Michael which on it's second journey was returning from Japan to Germany and sunk by a US sub.
the Komet actually circled the globe
the Kormoran on it's last op sank the HMAS Sydney but was damaged so bad with the Allied ship that she was abandoned and blown up. The demise of the Sydney is still a mystery today.
the Atlantis had an incredible journey under Rogge as well aas an impressive number of ship kills. Rogges book Ship 16 is still a classic....
the Komet actually circled the globe
the Kormoran on it's last op sank the HMAS Sydney but was damaged so bad with the Allied ship that she was abandoned and blown up. The demise of the Sydney is still a mystery today.
the Atlantis had an incredible journey under Rogge as well aas an impressive number of ship kills. Rogges book Ship 16 is still a classic....
Erich
the old Sage
Adolf Galland
Airman 1st Class
ummm...the total loss of u-boats is 749 by the Kriegsmarine and the total number commissioned was 1161
Crazy
Senior Airman
closer to 65% then, but still, it's an impressive number. *shrug*
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