Which was the best night fighter?

[Erich]

luftover as Mark said no-one is insulting you, why would we, you have come up with questions and or statements that you are answering but you are mixing up the LW night fighter aircraft. please refrain from trying to crack a joke and if you post serious enough for me to take it that way I will answer as well as others.

The SM attack was not seen except at a distance usually when an RAF heavy bomber was already on fire. the LW night fighters used an ammo of phosphor for quick fire effects and it was called glimmspur meaning it was very very faint tracer not seen clearly even up close. Generally speaking the aces could come from underneath at a great distance seeing the profile of the RAF bomber and could get underneath the heavy without being noticed while it was more of a danger for the LW pilot/crew if he chose the forward firing arms, some LW crews preferred not to use nor had it installed at all on the aircraft.

does this help explain abit ?

E

 

[HoHun]

Hi Erich,

>the LW night fighters used an ammo of phosphor for quick fire effects and it was called glimmspur meaning it was very very faint tracer not seen clearly even up close.

Was the Schräge Musik loaded with any tracers at all? I vaguely remember reading that tracers were (sometimes?) left out in order not to alarm the enemy in the case of a miss.

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

 

[Erich]

HH

that is what glimmspur is ~ faint hard to see tracers, the LW crews swore by them and in fact several notable crews used the upward firing arrangement exclusively on every mission, but as I mentioned some crews did not like it and had it removed from their arsenal.

E ~

 

[lesofprimus]

Heinz Schnaufer used the Shrage Muzik to horrendous effect... Saddle up underneath, undetected, aim for the wing root, boom............

If a night fighter was spotted and fired at, the pilot usually abandoned that attack and commenced another unseen delivery....

 

[HoHun]

Hi Erich,

>that is what glimmspur is ~ faint hard to see tracers, the LW crews swore by them and in fact several notable crews used the upward firing arrangement exclusively on every mission, but as I mentioned some crews did not like it and had it removed from their arsenal.

I'm familiar with Glimmspur, but it was my impression that it was the standard night tracer, not exactly hard to see but dim enough not to blind the attacker. (Even day tracers sometimes had a delay before the illumination ignited in order not to blind the pilot.)

So carrying tracers in the forward firing guns, but not in the Schräge Musik is what the practice was according to what I read. I wasn't talking about removing the entire Schräge Musik, just about tracers not being used with it as they were fired at point blank range anyway where the gunsight would be good enough, and the side-effect of tracers - the enemy could see them, too - was unwanted.

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

 

[Erich]

tracer rounds were standard in the Schrägwaffen arms according to Ju 88G-6 crews in 44-45

 

[HoHun]

Hi Erich,

>tracer rounds were standard in the Schrägwaffen arms according to Ju 88G-6 crews in 44-45

Thanks a lot, I didn't know that before!

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

 

[B-17engineer]

I say the Ju-88 because of it's speed

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

I say the Ju-88 because of it's speed

Mossie night fighters were faster....

 

[Erich]

depends on the variant for both

 

[Lucky13]

Greetings....
A few blue moons ago I'd have said the He-219 but today? Nope! It probably had potential to be developed further, better radar, rear defence, more powerful engines, but the war come to an end before that happened. It's a great looking bird, but good looks doesn't shoot down enemy planes....

As for the P-61, I'm not sure about her either actually. Not nimble enough for night stalking 109's and 190's...maybe occassionally rumble with the 88, 110 and the 217. Didn't a few of them nail a number of V-1 bombs?

The 110, old school I'd say but still working, but in the hands of an experienced crew....lethal.

The 217, too slow and too heavy...was it as bad as I remember it to be? What was her main drawbacks....wingload, underpowered, range?

And I can't decide between the Mossie or 88G-6. Probably depends on the quality and experience of the crew who wins this one...

 

[AL Schlageter]

Lucky, the P-61 was very nimble surprising American s/e fighters in the 1944 fighter test.

 

[Lucky13]

I stand corrected... But did they come into turning fights with 109's and 190's though?

 

[Erich]

no ops against 109's but against ground attack night Fw 190's and of course Ju 87D-3's and D-5's there were no D-7 or D-8's, the books have that stated incorrectly. I have some interesting side-lights from personal interviews of the C.O. of the US 425th nfs as well as a couple of pilots in that unit for one of my future book projects

 

[Lucky13]

Thanks Erich....

 

[Soren]

Besides the Me-262 the Ar-234 B-2N was easily the best nightfighter, sadly for the Germans however only two ever saw service.

 

[Erich]

Soren still not proven in combat as the weapons belly pack was used in the Austrian/Italien alps for ground attack work. several important NJG 100 aces from the Ost front moved into Bonnows small band of 2-3 Arado's It would of had to been redesigned and it was during 45 with a completely new front/nose and different radar set-ups including AI

 

[Soren]

How many units used the 2x MG151/20 belly pack for ground attack purposes ?

 

[Erich]

1 Soren the only nf unit using the Arado, the first commander was killed flying one.

here is a neat first hand acct, just a few minutes ago while I was out in the cold pruning Roses

It is a fact that jamming of radar and jamming of radio-frequencies increased very much at the end of war. These fellows came with more than 800 aircraft in different streams accompanied by 80 or more mosquitos, which were hanging over our airports before we took off. We took off at unlighted airports, staying very low after take off because we knew the area. Same for landing, in other words the hunters were hunted.

In Ju 88 we had 2 radio-operators who were playing, one on the radar set, the other on radios. In SN2, we could use alternate frequencies, which worked sometimes. Another method, clever radio-operators found out, was to look for maximum of interference: some bomber crews shipped out the "windows" like paper leaflets and produced a trail which a good radar operator could follow and give the pilot instructions to find the bomber stream.

I had a good Funker who worked perfect on the radar with Naxos. H2S,as you know, sends signals down like a cone, a good Funker can see this cone on Naxos and let the pilot fly upwards, flying in the cone until at the top of the cone the pilot sees the shadow. I talked later on to RAF pilots who thought they were hit by Flak fire but it was a nightfighter from below with "Schräge lMusik". The Lancs had no weapons below.I think I got more than 10 by Naxos. I dont remember any jamming of Naxos. We only lost exact Naxos radar guidance when H2S was switched off by RAF crew. But then we were already close to bomber stream.

So good so far on this first day of 2008, this e-mailing makes me thirsty

Prosit Neujahr

Peter

 

[Njaco]

Wasn't the Arado flown by Bonow and he felt the large amount of glass was detrimental to the nightfighting capabilities because of glare? He then preferred the Me 262. If not Bonow I may be confusing with another NJG ace.