Battle Damaged Aircraft of WW2

[Matt308]

okay

 

[BC1]

v2 - thanks for the excellent feedback on the Ju 88 minus the prop tips. I found the picture I mentioned and it is attached.

I also found a second photo of the 467BG B-24 cannon-shell hit which is being discussed at the moment. It appears your forumites are correct in their assumptions, the entry hole is visible in this photo.

Regards, and thanks again,

BC

 

[B-17engineer]

A cannon shell will not detonate until the contact fuse is activated.

Assuming the shell is conservatively travelling at 2500ft/sec, if the fuse is activated and detonates the explosive in 0.00005sec (or 5/100,000 thousands of a second) the shell will not detonate until 1.5in below the aluminum skin. So possibly an upper cannon shot from a fighter.

Dam... I assume you have a career in Engineering?

 

[Matt308]

Precariously... yes.

B, my calculations are nothing but algegra. My post does not make it so.

 

[Njaco]

A few that I've scrounged. The first is another shot of the B-17 that has been posted several times in this thread.

 

[Pong]

Is the B-17 the one that flew over Cologne and took a direct hit? I don't know, the damage seems familiar.

Anyway, great photos?

 

[Njaco]

yes, its another angle of this pic.....

 

[drgondog]

drgondog: Can you please identify your father (i.e. his name and rank) and his P-51 unit when the 22 March 1945 incident took place ? I'd like to include the picture in my slide show and would appreciate a few more details if possible.

BC

Lt. Col Bert W. Marshall, Jr. Group Exec 355th FG.


F.O.1810A. Both A and B Groups with a total of 54 Mustangs, provided Ramrod support to Second Division B-24s attacking Kitzingen airdrome. There were nine early returns.

Captain Bille's B Group provided close escort on Penetration, Target and Withdrawal Support after making rendezvous north of Verdun at 1130. A heavy concentration of bombs was observed on the airfield as well as large secondary explosions, believed to be oil storage dumps. Bille's 28 Mustangs broke escort over Aachen at 1450 and returned home with unfired guns.

Marshall's A Group also made rendezvous at 1130 and provided Penetration Support for lead boxes of 2nd BD B-24s until 1200. They departed the bombers at noon and swept ahead to the target. They strafed Memmingen, Wurzburg and Kitzingen to destroy 12 Me 262s, He 111s, Fw 190s and Me 109s, plus damaged 10 more. Lieutenant Dave Tuholski was hit by flak over Wurzburg and bellied his burning P-51 in at the edge of the field where he was rescued by German troops. Captain Silva claimed three and F/O Falvey picked up two for the high scores.

Anti-strafing poles at least 20 feet tall, combined with many batteries of light flak made strafing particularly hazardous. Marshall was again clobbered by flak on the flak battery suppression run during the first strafing pass at Kitzengen, lost half of his rudder and survived a snap roll near the deck. He limped back to England and crash landed WR-B "JANE VI" in at Steeple Morden for his fourth belly landing of the war. The Mustang was repaired and returned to service later.

Final score, 12 destroyed and 10 damaged on the ground for one loss (flak).

 

[drgondog]

Could have be caused by an AA shell before it detonated at a higher altitude.

Could be, but the hole for an unexploded 88 would be much less and 'cleaner'. There are shrapnel punctures all around that hole implying a burst.

OTH it is clearly an explosion from below which suggests a flak hit rather than fighter damage? Maybe a delayed fuse penetration from ABOVE, expoding just inside the fuselage

That looks about like a 40mm hit, possibly 30mm Mk108 but those rounds were more powerful than the 40mm.

Interesting question but I doubt something large and unexploded passing through...

 

[Erich]

Bill
Merry Christmas

say as to 40mm most likely a 37mm hit which was standard ground fit. 40mm bofors were not in useage for LW or Heer but quite frankly common with the KM late war on their ships of all sizes. our German member Delcryos has family members very familiar with this weapon while serving in the KM.

say by the way how many ground kills was your Dad credited with ?

 

[drgondog]

Bill
Merry Christmas

say as to 40mm most likely a 37mm hit which was standard ground fit. 40mm bofors were not in useage for LW or Heer but quite frankly common with the KM late war on their ships of all sizes. our German member Delcryos has family members very familiar with this weapon while serving in the KM.

say by the way how many ground kills was your Dad credited with ?

That makes sense on the 37mm - I did think that the airfield batteries were getting 40mm at end of war but easily mistaken..

Dad had 4 ground - all on April 13th. He was most proud that nobody was lost over Husum - more than the fact that this was single squadron best for the war...

I wonder if there were any 190D's at Husum. He remarked that the two 190s he blew up seemed to be D's..

 

[BC1]

drgondog:

Merry Christmas - and thanks for the excellent background info.

Have a lot of BD pictures in my collection, and I am really pleased to have so much background detail on this P-51 incident.

There is a very good (colour) pic of a 78FG P-51 (Lt Stier) which RTB at Duxford on 1 March 1945 minus much of the top half of the fin and rudder to flak, also strafing. Also a 357FG P-51B with severe fin flak damage, Feb 1945.

Re: the 467BG B-24 hit pictures. The 2nd BD B-24s didn't normally operate at heights which would bring them within the range of light flak like the 37 mm weapons you refer to ? So probably a 30 mm air-to-air from a fighter (Me 262 ?) but maybe we will never know.

Thanks again to all who have contributed to this excellent thread.

BC

 

[imalko]

Merry Christmas to you too Bob. And here are another two interesting pictures...

Messerschmitt Bf 109G-6, W.Nr. 161717, "white 6", flown by Pavel Zeleňak from Letka 13 (13th Squadron) of Slovak Air Arms, damaged in combat with Allied escort fighters and crash landed at Horna Streda on 26th June 1944.

Pictures from HT model Special magazine

 

[Aaron Brooks Wolters]

Twenty five years to the day before I was born Imalko.

 

[BC1]

A few more - comments welcomed !

BC

 

[Njaco]

Wow! gotta resize that one. Took me 3 days to scroll through it!

 

[B-17engineer]

Nice pics

 

[Airframes]

Heck yeah! Nice pics, but that B17 was so big, it fell out the side of my monitor, and I'm still trying to get the nose unstuck from the doorway into the next room!

 

[v2]

...

 

[vikingBerserker]

Wow, the 2nd one is amazing.