Best flying boat/amphibian of WWII?
- Thread starter Lucky13
- Start date
Ad: This forum contains affiliate links to products on Amazon and eBay. More information in Terms and rules
Your point being ? Remember you brought up the Mars of which only 6 were made!
parsifal
Colonel
Not disagreeing with that, but my source says "fully laden troops". Transport only, not an assault function.
The source for Emily is not clear whether the 64 troops mentioned are "fully laden" or not. I suspect not, ie they are just travelling as passengers, but im not completely sure
The source for Emily is not clear whether the 64 troops mentioned are "fully laden" or not. I suspect not, ie they are just travelling as passengers, but im not completely sure
Lancaster630
Airman 1st Class
- 282
- Feb 26, 2007
Reading the post saying 13 of any aircraft wouldn't make much difference made me think, surely even small numbers would all play their own part in that sides effort to win the war, it goes back to that "for the want of a nail" that ends up with a battle being lost because a message doesn't get delivered.
Best flying boat of the war for me would be either the Shagbat (Supermarine Walrus) or the Short SUnderland with the Catalina following closely behind, am I allowed 3? lol it gets difficult to chose one really because I start thinking this one was good at this, and the that one was good at something else and before I know it I have a list of 30 diffrent aicraft
Best flying boat of the war for me would be either the Shagbat (Supermarine Walrus) or the Short SUnderland with the Catalina following closely behind, am I allowed 3? lol it gets difficult to chose one really because I start thinking this one was good at this, and the that one was good at something else and before I know it I have a list of 30 diffrent aicraft
ToughOmbre
Senior Master Sergeant
Yes they probably would, however when comparing similiar types in a "which is best" type thread, I don't think you can compare an aircraft of which only13 examples were built to one that was produced in the thousands. There's just no body of work to make the comparison. That was the point I was trying to make.
TO
Hi everybody. I've really enjoyed reading your forum so I signed up today. Hope I can contribute something useful.
As to the question. If by best you mean potential and/or the top specifications then that's something that can include many planes with potential that made very little or, for whatever reason, no contribution to the war.
However, if you mean having a tangible impact then it's difficult to imagine a more effective plane that the PBY for so many reasons- the floating-flying swiss army knife: recon, attack, rescue of downed pilots, etc. For a plane deemed obsolete at beginning of the war, not too bad.
That being said it's a pity that the spruce goose and the BV-238 never had a chance to go into service!
As to the question. If by best you mean potential and/or the top specifications then that's something that can include many planes with potential that made very little or, for whatever reason, no contribution to the war.
However, if you mean having a tangible impact then it's difficult to imagine a more effective plane that the PBY for so many reasons- the floating-flying swiss army knife: recon, attack, rescue of downed pilots, etc. For a plane deemed obsolete at beginning of the war, not too bad.
That being said it's a pity that the spruce goose and the BV-238 never had a chance to go into service!
Dragonsinger
Airman
Hi Lanc603
Last Shagbat allive is in captivity at the FAA Museum Yeovilton. Helped transport it there in 69(ish) from HMS Condor at Arbroath.
And just for the argument I don't think it qualifies as the best but it certainly had a lot of roles, Rescue, reconnaissance, spotter. It was carried on various large warships as a messenger/artillery spotter.
There is a poem dedicated to them, don't know who wrote it but is is a direct plagiarism from Alice in Wonderland.
Dragonsinger
Last Shagbat allive is in captivity at the FAA Museum Yeovilton. Helped transport it there in 69(ish) from HMS Condor at Arbroath.
And just for the argument I don't think it qualifies as the best but it certainly had a lot of roles, Rescue, reconnaissance, spotter. It was carried on various large warships as a messenger/artillery spotter.
There is a poem dedicated to them, don't know who wrote it but is is a direct plagiarism from Alice in Wonderland.
The time has come the Shagbat said,
To talk of many things,
Of pusher props and Lewis guns,
And strutted swept back wings,
I'm an aeronautical wonder,
And if that's not enough,
I've whell that I can land on,
If the sea getsa a bit to rough.
To talk of many things,
Of pusher props and Lewis guns,
And strutted swept back wings,
I'm an aeronautical wonder,
And if that's not enough,
I've whell that I can land on,
If the sea getsa a bit to rough.
Dragonsinger
CA-35
Quote: "However, if you mean having a tangible impact then it's difficult to imagine a more effective plane that the PBY for so many reasons- the floating-flying swiss army knife: recon, attack, rescue of downed pilots, etc"
While not denying that PBY was a great and effective plane, all those missions you mentioned were also done for ex. by Dutch and LW Do 24 crews.
Of course the question of effectiveness is a complex one but even if PBY was much cheaper than H8K Emily the latter has much longer range and so could do missions that were impossible to PBY for example the bombing raid on Pear Harbor in early 42, which missed its target because of thick overcast but was noticed by US radars. They also flew succesful bombing raid for ex against Canton Is. And it also could carry 2 torpedoes.
But PBY was better than Emily in air-sea rescue, I think, but Do-24 and Walrus were probably as good as PBY in that. Do-24 was a bit faster and had longer range than PBY but could carry less ordanance than PBY.
Juha
Quote: "However, if you mean having a tangible impact then it's difficult to imagine a more effective plane that the PBY for so many reasons- the floating-flying swiss army knife: recon, attack, rescue of downed pilots, etc"
While not denying that PBY was a great and effective plane, all those missions you mentioned were also done for ex. by Dutch and LW Do 24 crews.
Of course the question of effectiveness is a complex one but even if PBY was much cheaper than H8K Emily the latter has much longer range and so could do missions that were impossible to PBY for example the bombing raid on Pear Harbor in early 42, which missed its target because of thick overcast but was noticed by US radars. They also flew succesful bombing raid for ex against Canton Is. And it also could carry 2 torpedoes.
But PBY was better than Emily in air-sea rescue, I think, but Do-24 and Walrus were probably as good as PBY in that. Do-24 was a bit faster and had longer range than PBY but could carry less ordanance than PBY.
Juha
Really?
I would think it could carry more. Sure its standard load was no more than 600lb of bombs, but I am sure she could carry more.
I find it hard to believe that it could not carry more. It certainly had a higher payload than the PBY, so it could not be that it could not carry the weight.
Hello Adler
I cannot help it, so the specs say. In fact the difference was bigger, checked from Creed's PBY book, Mk 13 torpedo weighted 2200lb not 2000lb I had remembered so max for PBY was 2000kg.
Why PBY could carry more ordanance, I don't know. My guess is that because both carried their ordanance under wings, no bomb bays here, the limiting factor was how the wings were stressed and Dutch demanded only 600kg bombload at the beginning. So Do 24 wings were designed for certain load at there was a limit which cannot be safely exceed. But that is only my guess.
Juha
I cannot help it, so the specs say. In fact the difference was bigger, checked from Creed's PBY book, Mk 13 torpedo weighted 2200lb not 2000lb I had remembered so max for PBY was 2000kg.
Why PBY could carry more ordanance, I don't know. My guess is that because both carried their ordanance under wings, no bomb bays here, the limiting factor was how the wings were stressed and Dutch demanded only 600kg bombload at the beginning. So Do 24 wings were designed for certain load at there was a limit which cannot be safely exceed. But that is only my guess.
Juha
Hello again Adler
checked that excellent Do 24 site Dornier Do-24 Homepage
and according to it K-2 could carry 300kg more than K-1 so max for Do 24 was 1500kg.
Juha
checked that excellent Do 24 site Dornier Do-24 Homepage
and according to it K-2 could carry 300kg more than K-1 so max for Do 24 was 1500kg.
Juha
FLYBOYJ
"THE GREAT GAZOO"
and 2 are still flying....
syscom3
Pacific Historian
There are other criteria to consider on wat was best.
1) Sea state capability for takeoff and landings. All the load figures mean nothing if it cant land or take off except in ideal conditions.
2) Low speed handling and endurance. If you're escorting convoys, you need endurance. Same with sub hunting. Low speed handling is mightly important when hanging around keeping a sub submerged.
1) Sea state capability for takeoff and landings. All the load figures mean nothing if it cant land or take off except in ideal conditions.
2) Low speed handling and endurance. If you're escorting convoys, you need endurance. Same with sub hunting. Low speed handling is mightly important when hanging around keeping a sub submerged.
Good points syscom
Do 24 had excellent seekeeping qualities and its crews doesn't need to worry on digging a side floats into heavy seas or on loosing one because it depends on sponsons for stability on the water. Both PBY and H8K had good seekeping qualities but in both cases digging a float into sea during take off or landing could have been fatal.
Juha
Do 24 had excellent seekeeping qualities and its crews doesn't need to worry on digging a side floats into heavy seas or on loosing one because it depends on sponsons for stability on the water. Both PBY and H8K had good seekeping qualities but in both cases digging a float into sea during take off or landing could have been fatal.
Juha
I think that is a very good guess, and I am inclined to agree with you.
Winning side doesn't have to scrap its a/c as parts are in plentyful supply and the design is native, that's the explanation for why those two are flying today. Had Germany won you'd probably have seen BV-222's BV-238's still flying..
Users who are viewing this thread
Similar threads
