Coronavirus Thread

[michael rauls]

Chloroquine can have very serious and common side affects, including depression and suicidal thoughts. Its actually pretty common.

In Iraq we were all given chloroquine to prevent malaria. Many complained of nasty effects. I actually stopped taking it. I decided I would take my chances with malaria (pretty shitty decision to make) because I just felt terrible.

True but a few tonic waters a day is very unlikely result in those side effects. Ive never heard of it and lots of people drink it.
And like I said it appears that even a small dose should be helpful to inhibit viral replication.
Ive been tipping back 4 or 5 a day since last week( so 40 or 50mg) and have had none of the side affects at all.

 

[at6]

Two days ago Fresno County had 6 cases, today it's 13 and rising. So far no one has died but that could change at any time as our 5 county region reported 35 cases of the virus with one recovery in a neighboring county. As for the age groups, the young are an ever increasing number in the ICUs. They thought that they were invincible as do many of them.

 

[michael rauls]

Let me be clear. I certainly wouldn't advocate taking a madicinal dose of quinine without seeing a doctor. However, I don't think a couple tonic waters a day, maybe just until this thing is over( unless you really like it) is likely to have any negative affects and by all indications appears that it will most certainly be beneficial if one is unfortunate enough to be exposed to this.

 

[TheMadPenguin]

Seeing as how we don't need a federal license or prescription for Gin & Tonic (or just the tonic) I'll reckon it falls in the category "it couldn't hurt, try it as a prophylactic".

What juice does a good (non-alcoholic) job of smothering the taste of the tonic?

 

[MiTasol]

Chloroquine can have very serious and common side affects, including depression and suicidal thoughts. Its actually pretty common.

In Iraq we were all given chloroquine to prevent malaria. Many complained of nasty effects. I actually stopped taking it. I decided I would take my chances with malaria (pretty shitty decision to make) because I just felt terrible.

In PNG most FIFO and long term expats do not take any anti-malarials as the modern medical practice in this country says that the side effects of chloroquine use are far far worse than getting the malaria and taking modern medication for that. Mind you PNG only has two types of malaria, vivax and cerebal so this may not be a good program in many other countries with other variants. Modern malarial medicines, especially the French one whose name I cannot recall right now, are excellent if taken in accordance with the instructions. Unfortunately Artemeter and Fansidar which were really good 10-15 years ago are now next to useless because the nationals stop taking the medicine (and sell the remaining script to others) as soon as they feel "cured". This naturally resulted in Artemeter and Fansidar resistant malaria.

One exploration company wanted all of our staff on their sites to take doxicyclin daily as a prophalactic. A letter from the International Medical Research institute in Chicago with a covering letter from our company lawyer stopped that dead in its tracks. Discovering that someone is allergic to Doxi after their first dose at an exploration site in the wet season with a good chance of being weathered in for a week was never in their original calculations.

 

[GrauGeist]

What juice does a good (non-alcoholic) job of smothering the taste of the tonic?

Citrus juices go well with Tonic water (without alcohol) like Orange juice with a small bit of Lemon juice.

You'll have to adjust for taste.

 

[buffnut453]

Two days ago Fresno County had 6 cases, today it's 13 and rising. So far no one has died but that could change at any time as our 5 county region reported 35 cases of the virus with one recovery in a neighboring county. As for the age groups, the young are an ever increasing number in the ICUs. They thought that they were invincible as do many of them.

That's inline with the "doubling rate" assessment in the MITRE paper a few pages back which indicated the US had the worst doubling rate of all assessed countries (about 1.8 days - very short, leading to exponential growth). That means if your county has 13 cases today (Tues), by Thurs it'll be 26, by Saturday 52 and on Monday 104...give it another week or so, if no direct action is taken, your county may well be struggling with thousands of new cases every day.

 

[MiTasol]

An Irish appreciation of the situation

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

How bad were these side effect in the first 6-10 days? (serious question here)
I can see these effect affecting a trooper's work, especially if you don't have the malaria, but somebody in isolation who does have COVID-19 might see things a bit different.

do you meam someone in isolation that does not have a strong support network to recognize that something is mentally wrong with the person?

They were pretty strong effects. That does not mean everyone will get them, but it was enough that many in my unit started throwing the pills away.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

ALSO THIS FORUM IS NOT A PLACE FOR NON-MEDICAL PERSONNEL AND NON-PROFESSIONAL EXPERTS TO GIVE ADVISE ON TAKING MEDICINES OR OTHER TREATMENTS APPROVED OR OTHERWISE.

LEAVE THAT TO THE DOCTORS PLEASE.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

True but a few tonic waters a day is very unlikely result in those side effects. Ive never heard of it and lots of people drink it.
And like I said it appears that even a small dose should be helpful to inhibit viral replication.
Ive been tipping back 4 or 5 a day since last week( so 40 or 50mg) and have had none of the side affects at all.

It is quite common with chloroquine and other malaria drugs, and is well documented. Leave the medical advice to the Doctors, before someone reads it, and gets themselves hurt or worse by taking something they shouldn't. Just like this guy and his wife in Arizona.

A man died after ingesting a substance he thought would protect him from coronavirus

Again, leave the medical advice to the Doctors and professionals.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Let me be clear. I certainly wouldn't advocate taking a madicinal dose of quinine without seeing a doctor. However, I don't think a couple tonic waters a day, maybe just until this thing is over( unless you really like it) is likely to have any negative affects and by all indications appears that it will most certainly be beneficial if one is unfortunate enough to be exposed to this.

I am only referring to any specific advice about medications.

 

[michael rauls]

Ok...........that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting for researching a couple common dietary items that might help people here. 3 vitamins and a type of soda pop........sometimes food is the best medicine as they say.......I always feel compelled to help friends in time of need but fair enough.......I won't mention it again.

 

[michael rauls]

If I could just give a corollary example. I don't think suggesting that blue cheese might be helpful with certain digestive conditions, which it is, would somehow constitute medical advice because it contains a very small amount of penecilim mold. I certainly didn't think I was giving medical advice nor do I see how it could be interpreted that way. Lot of guys here mentioned vitamins and at least one an actual medication. But fair enough this isn't my parade I just march in it , so no more dietary thoughts from me

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Ok...........that wasn't exactly the response I was expecting for researching a couple common dietary items that might help people here. 3 vitamins and a type of soda pop........sometimes food is the best medicine as they say.......I always feel compelled to help friends in time of need but fair enough.......I won't mention it again.

I'm referring to the chloroquine references, I can care less about you or anyone talking about food or water.

Also I was making a general statement to everyone regarding medicine advice. Last I checked only one of us here is a Dr.

 

[mikewint]

"A man has died and his wife is under critical care after the couple, both in their 60s, ingested chloroquine phosphate, an additive commonly used at aquariums to clean fish tanks," one of the anti-malaria drugs that President Trump has mentioned in recent days, according to Banner Health, the hospital system that treated both patients.

Why it matters: People who attempt to self-medicate risk serious side effects or death, and it's why any messaging about chloroquine and the related hydroxychloroquine should emphasize that these drugs have not been approved to prevent or treat the new coronavirus.

Worth noting: The malaria drug comes in tablet form, but the type the couple used was a toxic substance — not medication.

• The man's wife told NBC News: "I had it in the house because I used to have koi fish."

Editor's note: This story has been updated to reflect the fact that the form of chloroquine the couple ingested was used in aquariums — and it was not a medication.

Nigeria is reporting two poisonings from the drug chloroquine, a drug that's been touted as a potential but as-yet unproven treatment for coronavirus,Bloomberg reports.

 

[buffnut453]

Just throwing out another chart to illustrate why social distancing is so important:

 

[michael rauls]

"A man has died and his wife is under critical care after the couple, both in their 60s, ingested chloroquine phosphate, an additive commonly used at aquariums to clean fish tanks," one of the anti-malaria drugs that President Trump has mentioned in recent days, according to Banner Health, the hospital system that treated both patients.

Why it matters: People who attempt to self-medicate risk serious side effects or death, and it's why any messaging about chloroquine and the related hydroxychloroquine should emphasize that these drugs have not been approved to prevent or treat the new coronavirus.

Worth noting: The malaria drug comes in tablet form, but the type the couple used was a toxic substance — not medication.

• The man's wife told NBC News: "I had it in the house because I used to have koi fish."

Editor's note: This story has been updated to reflect the fact that the form of chloroquine the couple ingested was used in aquariums — and it was not a medication.

Nigeria is reporting two poisonings from the drug chloroquine, a drug that's been touted as a potential but as-yet unproven treatment for coronavirus,Bloomberg reports.

Ok, thanks Mike but just to be clear what I said was that a couple tonic waters and a good multi vitamin with zinc etc. might be helpful. Feel like people are taking what I said and really going off the deep end with it.

 

[pbehn]

You cant self medicate, "hydroxychloroquine" just sounds like "chloroquine". Even using industrial oxygen instead of medical oxygen can kill. Warfarin is/was used as a rat poison and a drug to treat thrombosis that doesn't mean you take a bit of rat poison when your prescription runs out.

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

Ok, thanks Mike but just to be clear what I said was that a couple tonic waters and a good multi vitamin with zinc etc. might be helpful. Feel like people are taking what I said and really going off the deep end with it.

I'm not going off any deep end. In your first post you referenced small sample sizes and specific medications to combat a virus that have not been verified. Despite the FDA, CDC, and Doctors saying further tests have to be done to determine its effectiveness and safety when treating the coronavirus, so it is not recommended. It is a drug with dangerous side affects. Chloroquine is not a vitamin you should tip back 3 or 4 a day to ward off viral infection. Despite these warnings, our wonderful leader went out and ran his mouth telling people he endorsed it, and now several people are dead or in critical condition in the USA and Nigeria.

The same goes with Zinc which you referenced as well. Zinc in too high of a dosage is toxic.

My point is tell people all you want to drink water, eat vegetables and fruits, but leave the actual medicinal advice to the experts, i.e. the doctors. Something that neither you or I are.