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"It was Germany declaring war on the US, that gave us the excuse to declare war on them. If Germany had stayed on the sidelines after Dec 7th, then there is every indication the US would have stayed out of the European war."
I disagree. There was actually every indication that the U.S. going to war with Germany was inevitable. The U.S/United Kingdom ties were too strong, as were Churchill and Roosevelt's. The U.S. was defacto arming the Brits from early on and Germany almost precipitated war by having the BB Texas in a U-boats sights. With U-boats sinking ships on both sides of the Atlantic and in the Caribbean (and, indeed in the Gulf of Mexico), and with Britain's increasingly bad situation, public outcry would have increased until war was declared.
tom
You're forgetting that even on the eve of Pearl harbor, the isolationist crowd was still quite strong. And even on the evening of Dec 7th, there were still large numbers of congressman and senators that still hoped we would not be drawn into the European conflict.
And your also forgetting that the purpose of this thread is to show that without the US getting involved, then "contiental" Europe would be speaking German or Russian.
Hmmm, dont have much faith in that Tom...It was inevitable that the U.S. would get involved and have an impact of the lanquage spoken in Europe.
AND FOR THE FU*KIN RECORD, ITS CONTINENTAL.... Ur both meatballs...
As to syscoms very detailed question "German or Russian", my mind believes that in occupied France, Germans impregnate Frenchies, have little braut eating blonde knights speaking German like their Daddys and their pals, Mayors and garbage collectors.... I would also assume that these little blonde German-Frenchies would also hang out/be babysitted etc etc by his mothers grandparents who speak only French....
Bi-lingual German teenagers running across Belgium and France, breeding with German speaking French/German maidens with hairy armpits....
German speaking children......
German takes over French by being breeded out through generations... I can buy that....
I am a firm believer that if a World War ever breaks out again in Europe, the loser has to keep France.
I am a firm believer that if a World War ever breaks out again in Europe, the loser has to keep France.
I am a firm believer that if a World War ever breaks out again in Europe, the loser has to keep France.
"Agrre'd. But by the time they can go to Europe, the war has been decided for Russia or Germany."
You seem 100% sure of this; if anything the war certainly would not have been decided by 1945 - it would be dragging on.
Britain and her Commonwealth provided tens of thousands of aircraft; and hundreds of thousands of trucks for the war effort. South Africa, Canada, Australia, India, New Zealand and Great Britain collectively had enough industrial capacity to run Germany into the ground.
If the U.S had never geared up for war; we wouldn't be saying the U.S had the industrial might or army because prior to World War II - it was pretty pathetic.
And syscom, do a little research and tell me how many U.S citizens were illiterate in 1941 - I'll give you a hint; it's around 40%. But yet the U.S managed to train and deployed hundreds of thousands of troops to the war effort ... how did they do this? The idea that the Commonwealth was, apparently, mostly illiterate so they can't fight is laughable.
Nevertheless; we need not compare the industrial capacity and manpower to the U.S - you compare to Germany. Where the British Commonwealth out-numbered and out-produced Germany.
I think you should accept that you don't know squat about the AFVs of World War II - in both 1939 and 1940; plus most of 1941 German AFVs were poor at best. Faced up against the British Maltida they were in deep trouble ...and against the Soviet T-34! It was only until the Pz.Kpfw IV F/2 came along and the L/60 armed Pz.Kpfw III arrived that German armour began to pick up. When the Pz.Kpfw VI E arrived ... three years after the war started ...German AFVs became the bench-mark.
Great Britain was out-producing Germany in fighters; combined the VVS and RAF numbers and you'll see Germany are heavily inferior numbers wise in a fighter force. Plus the fact; Britain was on the offensive and Germany wasn't stopping it - even before the U.S came along.
Syscom;THE RAF WAS BOMBING BY DAY AND NIGHT
It may not have been with the numbers the USAAF deployed - but given the better tactics and better weapons; Britain could have been destroying the vital German targets instead of just plastering it - like the USAAF did. Operation Crossbow[/b] being a perfect example of American over-kill in the air offensive. The 2nd TAF destroyed more Noball sites than the U.S 9th Air Force for far less sorties ... the only force to destroy more Noball sites was the U.S 8th Air Force with a hell of a lot more effort and sortie numbers.
The facts are clear; Britain had a navy large enough to defeat the Kriegsmarine in 1939 all the way through 1945. The only problem the Royal Navy encountered was when fighting the Italian, Japanese and German but since the U.S is still fighting the Japanese navy then Britain is fine handling the German and Italian on its own.