Terrorist attack In New Zealand

[parsifal]

Ive just learnt that there has been a mass shooting in the Kiwi city of Christchurch. So far, reports are that 30 people have been murdered.

This is a first order tragedy and a black day, make no mistake. I wanted to express my sympathy and support for the New Zealand people in this forum. Your country has a long history with mine....we have shed blood together for a common cause many times before. I want you guys to know that im appalled by whats happened and at least express my sympathy for where you guys are at the moment. ,

 

[rednev]

Ive just learnt that there has been a mass shooting in the Kiwi city of Christchurch. So far, reports are that 30 people have been murdered.

This is a first order tragedy and a black day, make no mistake. I wanted to express my sympathy and support for the New Zealand people in this forum. Your country has a long history with mine....we have shed blood together for a common cause many times before. I want you guys to know that im appalled by whats happened and at least express my sympathy for where you guys are at the moment. ,

The more details that emerge both sadden me and infuriate me . such a senseless act

 

[Marcel]

Right extremists. People never learn.

 

[parsifal]

Body count is now touching 50. Two of the killers now apprehended. one was from Australia. I am mortified by that

 

[Wayne Little]

Very Sad indeed....

 

[Wurger]

Agreed.

 

[vikingBerserker]

Violent extremist from either side are not a good thing. My deepest sympathy to the victims, their families and to our Kiwi friends.

 

[tomo pauk]

I'm apalled. Condolences to the families & friends of the victims

 

[DerAdlerIstGelandet]

My condolences to everyone.

A senseless act of evil.

 

[Shortround6]

Words cannot express my disgust at the perpetrators and the thinking (if you can call it such) behind an act like this.
Nor can I express my sorrow for the victims and their families and friends.

 

[Gnomey]

Just appalling, horrible news to wake up to this morning. Having spent time there it's a wonderful part of the world with everybody really friendly. Thankfully my friends in the area are all safe.

My condolences to everyone.

 

[parsifal]

Another body has been discovered at one of the mosques. The death toll now stands at 50. Other injured people are still high risks of becoming fatalities

A picture of the gunman is beginning to emerge. Using the principles first expressed by Sun Tzu to "know your enemy" I forced myself to study some of the known facts and opinions expressed by this man. there is a manifesto attributed to this man which I have not read directly. I am relying on the free press reports at the moment because in no way do I want to inflame or appear to support these actions. people can draw their own conclusions .

He identifies himself as a European, though he is an Australian citizen. He is very dismissive of his Australian heritage. He describes us as a very poor extension of Europe, a British colony in which we are obsessed with drink and gambling. Im not sure where I fit in with that, since I am Australian, but I don't drink, smoke, or gamble. I have served my country and carried and fired weapons in my country's name. Nowadays I will not touch any firearm and will not take up any weapon for personal reasons . The notion that violence can achieve peace and security is false. "Violence begats violence" ….. a descent to mindless violence with the feature being attacks on the innocent or defenceless destroys what we seek to protect in the first place and returns nothing. The peace and stability enjoyed in Europe after WWII was not achieved by the violence of WWII. WWII was necessary stop a particular form of lunacy. The stability and prosperity for Europe, germany in particular, came about by the abandonment of violence.

By this man's definition I mustn't be an Australian it seems. The man is hostile to environmental issues it seems.

He says he is committed to securing the future for white European children. I don't follow the logic there. how does racial or religious hatred serve to promote anything other than more religious hate and prejudice. I am not defending Muslims here, I am defending the right of the freedom to choose and co-existence. That is THE only way to move forward in my opinion.

Im trying to make sense of why someone would be motivated to kill 50 innocent people. . Ive concluded there is no sense, no reason for criminal insanity.
Ive quoted the following from an online press link (https://www.smh.com.au/world/oceani...e-supremacy-over-muslims-20190315-p514ko.html) which gives some information on the manifesto that he followed:

" Several photos the shooter is believed to have posted on Twitter earlier this week show various ammunition cartridges, a rifle and a bulletproof vest decorated in the same white writing. The photos were shared on an account that appeared to belong to the gunman, Reuters reported. Twitter has suspended the account.

The bodycam footage makes it difficult to read the names on the weapons, but the Twitter photos are clear. The equipment is scrawled with the names of several white people who have attacked Muslims, either in recent terror incidents or during the Crusades and other wars against the Ottoman Empire. The suspected gunman's gear also features several neo-Nazi references, and the names and dates of centuries-old battles in which many Muslims were killed. A handful of other inscriptions refer to more recent incidents involving Muslims.

"For Rotherham, Alexandre Bissonette (sic), Luca Traini," one [cartridge] reads.

"Rotherham" appears to refer to a child sex abuse ring that was unearthed in Rotherham, Britain, in 2015. A Pakistani gang was found to have sexually exploited at least 1,400 children between 1997 and 2013 in the small British town.

Bissonnette murdered six worshippers and injured 19 others at a mosque in Quebec City in January 2017. He was sentenced last month to life in prison without the possibility of parole for 40 years, although his lawyers are hoping to shorten that sentence with an appeal.

Bissonette's name also appears to have been written on the grip of one of the gunman's rifles, based on still images from the bodycam video.

Luca Traini is an Italian neo-Nazi sympathizer who wounded six African migrants in a racially-motivated series of drive-by shootings in Macerata, Italy, on Feb. 3, 2017. Authorities reportedly seized several pieces of Nazi propaganda from his home after his arrest, including a copy of Adolf Hitler's autobiography, Mein Kampf. Traini was sentenced to 12 years in prison for the attack.

The Cyrillic text refers to a 1770 victory by a small Russian army over a much larger Turkish one. Other Cyrillic inscriptions on the gunman's gear refer to four Serbs who fought against the Ottoman Empire's occupation of the Balkans.

Sebastiano Venier was a Venetian admiral who won a naval battle against the Ottoman empire in 1571. His name appears at least twice on the suspect's equipment.

Another photo shows a bulletproof vest decorated with a black sun, or sonnerad. The symbol dates back to the Nordic Vikings of ancient Europe, but it was later appropriated by the Nazis and has since become a symbol of white supremacy, according to the Anti-Defamation League. Neo-Nazis have adopted many Nordic symbols and runes attributed to the ancient Vikings.

The photo also shows dog tags decorated with the Celtic cross, which has been adopted by the white supremacy movement, and another version of the sonnerad.

The suspect's equipment is also marked with multiple references to "14" or "14 words," a shorthand for a white supremacist slogan from Hitler's Mein Kampf. The slogan calls for securing a future "for white children."

Josue Estebanez is currently serving a 26-year prison sentence in Spain after fatally stabbing a 16-year-old anti-fascist protester in Madrid in 2007. Estebanez was a former soldier.

The stock on one of the suspect's guns is inscribed with the words: "Here's your migration compact!" This appears to be a reference to the UN's Global Compact for Safe, Orderly and Regular Migration, a non-binding pact signed by 164 UN nations, including Canada, last December. The pact encourages a set of agreed-upon principles and indicators for governments around the world to follow as they tackle large-scale migration. It also aims to crack down on the often dangerous and illegal movements of migrants across borders.

The compact has become a lightning rod for criticism in many countries, including Canada, the United States and several European nations. It's also a frequent target for anti-immigrant and white supremacist groups, many of whom complain that it compromises the sovereignty of the countries in the compact.

The agreement does not actually force countries to do anything, and it is not legally binding.

(my note: even thinking the wrong way is punishable by death it seems)

He can also be heard listening to a Serbian nationalist song in the attack video. The song glorifies Serbian fighters in the 1992-95 war that tore Yugoslavia apart. It also paints a positive picture of Radovan Karadzic, a Bosnia Serb whom the UN jailed for genocide and other war crimes against Bosnian Muslims".

Descent into hell is my opinion.

 

[Zipper730]

The whole shooting is so bizarre.

 

[michael rauls]

This is truly terable. The perpetrator is truly crazy as well as evil, expressing both far left wing and right wing ideologies simultaneously in his manifesto. My condolences to the whole of New Zealand and to the victims and families in particular.

 

[nuuumannn]

Thank you for your kind words, Michael and others; we just found out that an Air NZ aircraft engineer was one of those killed, so a little close to home for us at work.

This is certainly a mind f*ck here as most people I know are in disbelief that such a thing has happened. This was the first ever religiously motivated terrorist attack in New Zealand; the only other terrorist attack of note was the bombing by French government agents of the Greenpeace ship the Rainbow Warrior in Auckland harbour in the 80s, so such things don't happen here often. Gun violence is also rare here, although on the increase and there is an immediate worry that police will resort to the carriage of personal firearms, which the police have openly stated they do not wish to do. Police vehicles all hold assault rifles aboard them, however, so our police are far from unarmed. Nevertheless, we don't want our little country to head in that direction.

 

[Capt. Vick]

 

[Graeme]

Very sad.

 

[wlewisiii]

I am left wanting to cry. Nothing more.

I served 16 years in the US Army, ready to give everything at the slightest notice, during that time. In the end I only quit because I couldn't do the job of an Infantry NCO any more so I walked away with my Honorable discharge. This evil SOB is everything I have fought against my entire life. I still stand ready in my oath to the US Constitution to defend it against all enemies, foreign and domestic, with no regard for myself. If I see these right wing scum here, I will go down fighting.

Some times it is really that simple. The fascists must be stopped for freedom to survive. If that costs us our lives, so what? Our grandchildren's lives depend on us stomping these scum into the ground, just as we did in 1945. We must fight for freedom for everyone one who is H. Sapiens Sapiens.

Yeah, it really is that simple.

 

[Zipper730]

This is truly terable. The perpetrator is truly crazy as well as evil, expressing both far left wing and right wing ideologies simultaneously in his manifesto.

That's what I meant, when I said the whole shooting was bizarre. It seemed almost as if the guy was playing games with everybody.

He seemed to have no ideology whatsoever, but was merely killing people "for the lulz" as some people online will say; then hiding behind an ideology. I don't think he had any ideology -- he was some kind of nihilist -- he saw life as meaningless, and apparently thought this whole thing was a joke.

Some have even described this guy's conduct as "real life trolling", which I disagree: Most trolls are not nice people, but they act like such assholes online because they know if they did it up close and personal, they'd get their asses-kicked, or worse. Being on the internet provides a degree of physical and emotional detachment, which makes it easier to be a royal asshole.

This guy was clearly not afraid of using violence up close and personal -- he was different -- he was a psychopath.

 

[swampyankee]

That's what I meant, when I said the whole shooting was bizarre. It seemed almost as if the guy was playing games with everybody.

He seemed to have no ideology whatsoever, but was merely killing people "for the lulz" as some people online will say; then hiding behind an ideology. I don't think he had any ideology -- he was some kind of nihilist -- he saw life as meaningless, and apparently thought this whole thing was a joke.

Some have even described this guy's conduct as "real life trolling", which I disagree: Most trolls are not nice people, but they act like such assholes online because they know if they did it up close and personal, they'd get their asses-kicked, or worse. Being on the internet provides a degree of physical and emotional detachment, which makes it easier to be a royal asshole.

This guy was clearly not afraid of using violence up close and personal -- he was different -- he was a psychopath.

He did have an ideology: it was there on his guns, in his writing, and in his words.

Right wing terror is very real.