- Thread starter
- #141
Lucky13
Forum Mascot
Much obliged Micdrow, thanks! Does it say anything about his machine's Wk. Nr.?
Udo Corde, Ju 88C-6 Zerstörer, 5K+RT, Wk. Nr. 360379 of 9.(Eis.)/KG 3...
- Thread starter Lucky13
- Start date
Ad: This forum contains affiliate links to products on Amazon and eBay. More information in Terms and rules
Erich
the old Sage
most likely you are correct Jan about this being the fatal crash, I cannot see anyone walking away from the remains with the nose ripped off, wings an fuselage torn back, still even with the article and I own it when first published there is still much that is unknown about the Train-jägers
Erich
the old Sage
yes but some it has been translated though for those that cannot understand the language, look to the right side of the pages.
Yeah your right Eric, I took the easy way out. Im racking my brain out though. I know Ive seen that winged wheel emblem some where. The article even went so far at to just post a picture specfic of that emblem seperate from the KG 3 emblem
Erich
the old Sage
yes you have seen it which ID'd the squadron, being a train symbol with a wheel ans wing. very much perfect if you know what I mean. another squadron used cannon armed He 111's, slow but like a porcupine if you will with many thorns right in the Soviets arse. not sure if the wing and wheel are in dirty white or yellow. please note the spinner tip - yellow, but also the background of the wappenshield with the lighting bolt over it.
Junkers88A1
Staff Sergeant
great thread 
love it and to correct one small thing ( actually two )
now all Ju 88 radiators are painted RLM 02 and the top oilcooler is silver.. and about the undercarriagelegs..the shiny polished part in the abornerarea. ( the part that goes up and down to take the grunts from landing ) is always covered with mattblack leather or darkbrown ) but most WW2 german aircrfats that are beeing made today misses this part and present the undercarriagelegs with shiny legs..as the elather is missing on 99% of the surviving german aircrafts.
That part would not look nice if sand and dust keept getting in there and grinded the whole thing ..
just a small thing.. but will be a nice buildt..havent seen this thread before .. wonder how i missed this
GF
love it and to correct one small thing ( actually two )now all Ju 88 radiators are painted RLM 02 and the top oilcooler is silver.. and about the undercarriagelegs..the shiny polished part in the abornerarea. ( the part that goes up and down to take the grunts from landing ) is always covered with mattblack leather or darkbrown ) but most WW2 german aircrfats that are beeing made today misses this part and present the undercarriagelegs with shiny legs..as the elather is missing on 99% of the surviving german aircrafts.
That part would not look nice if sand and dust keept getting in there and grinded the whole thing ..
just a small thing..
but will be a nice buildt..havent seen this thread before .. wonder how i missed thisGF
- Thread starter
- #148
Lucky13
Forum Mascot
Saw that Ernst had been quite busy up to May '43.... 8 bridges, 19 tanks, 32 artillery pieces, 96 trucks and 9 transport trains, including 2 munitions trains....I take it that this was beside his 63 locomotives, right?
Thanks for posting the PDF file Micdrow!
Thanks for posting the PDF file Micdrow!
Junkers88A1
Staff Sergeant
some spellingerrors..but i hope you see what i mean...
take a look at these two pictures..and look at the legs ( on the 88 between the "scissors " ) and the He 111.. the shiny area is not there..its covered with leather to prevent them from getting dirty as this area is oiled..and guess how that would look if it was not covered/protected after one take of from a dirty grassfield or runway made of dirt and sand.. ) and that would really make havoc on the legs..
take a look at these two pictures..and look at the legs ( on the 88 between the "scissors " ) and the He 111.. the shiny area is not there..its covered with leather to prevent them from getting dirty as this area is oiled..and guess how that would look if it was not covered/protected after one take of from a dirty grassfield or runway made of dirt and sand.. ) and that would really make havoc on the legs..
Attachments
- Thread starter
- #150
Lucky13
Forum Mascot
Thanks for the heads up Gutt! I've been wondering as to which paint to use for those covers, good to know that black or dark brown would be alright then.... 
Junkers88A1
Staff Sergeant
the ones that has survived on the 88`s we salvaged was black ( the A5 ) and dark brown on the A1..i guess the A5 was older so it had more wear and tear and the oil binds the dirt so it get blacker and blacker the more its used i guess but same thick leather on both 88`s
so its up to you to decide what youw ant to go for
but same thick leather on both 88`s so its up to you to decide what youw ant to go for
Erich
the old Sage
the scores of the other material was probably flying a bombed up Ju. the trains in whatever capacity were part of his count on the tail most likely but note like Codes's a/c tail the Soviet crate kills (2) ?
- Thread starter
- #153
Lucky13
Forum Mascot
Talking about something slightly different now.... Gutt and Erich, what do you know about Werner Baumbach and his '88 in Norway A6+HH, where in Norway was based and how did he manage to sink that amount of ships with an A-4....bombs, torpedoes?
Erich
the old Sage
personally I do not know much about the man. RK-EL winner in III./KG 30 flying Ju 88's torpedo or bombs or both ? just not sure sadly
Your welcome Jan!!!
Maybe these will help you on that Jan. Aircraft based out of Norway.
Luftwaffe in Norway
Nordic Aviation During WW2
Luftwaffe in Norway
Nordic Aviation During WW2
Erich
the old Sage
Jan you ight want to repost to anothe thread on Werner
from an expanded wiki-europ article
Anti-shipping specialist and Bomber General.
Werner Baumbach was born on 27 December 1916 in Cloppenburg, Germany. While still going to college he flew gliders and was admitted as a cadet to the Luftwaffe in 1936. In 1938 he was promoted to lieutenant and became an instructor for instrument flying.
At the beginning of the war he flew bomber missions with KG 30 over Poland and received the Iron Cross 2nd Class after a successful raid against Warsaw airport. After the Polish campaign, KG 30 became the first unit to be equipped with Ju 88 and relocated to airfields at the North Sea. In March 40 Baumbach's unit made the first dive-bombing attacks in the Ju 88 against the British Fleet in Firth of Forth and Scapa Flow, although these attacks accomplished little.
During operation Weserübung Baumbach flew anti-shipping missions over Norway. On 19 April 40 he damaged the French cruiser 'Emile Bertin' with his Ju 88 over Andalsnes, earning him the Iron Cross 1st Class. Since High Command eventually assumed she had been sunk (which was not the case), Baumbach was awarded the Knight's Cross for the sinking.
During the French campaign Baumbach flew anti-AA missions over Holland in preparation for German paradrops and attacked the beaches during the Dunkirk evacuation. In June 1940 he was selected for a special courier mission, flying from Berlin to Tokyo, via Moscow. He returned to KG 30 after the Battle of Britain. The unit's mission now was the blockade of Great Britain but it flew also bombing missions against London during the winter of 40/41. During one of these missions Baumbach's Ju 88 lost an engine over the British capital but he managed to crash-land it on Dutch soil, Baumbach being injured in the process. After returning to his unit in January 1941, Baumbach dropped mines in the Themse estuary but soon began to attack allied shipping in the Atlantic. By 14 July 1941 Baumbach had sunk about 240 000 tons of Allied shipping and was awarded the 20th Oak Leaves in the German armed forces. On 20 July 41, Baumbach became commander of KG 30.
As an elite anti-shipping unit, KG 30 was sent to hot spots over the Black Sea, the Mediteranean and again over the Atlantic in early 1942. In August 42, KG 30 started to attack the Murmansk convoys from Stavanger, Norway. During that year, Baumbach had added another 60 000 tons of tonnage sunk, earning him the Swords to his Knight's Cross. Baumbach was the first German bomber pilot to receive this award. Baumbach had by now become a Major and his unit was once more transferred to the Mediteranean, tasked with attacking Allied shipping near Algers during operation 'Torch'. But the Luftwaffe organisation on the Sicily air fields was not up to such a major task, crews, planes, fuel and mechanics existed only on paper. Baumbach frankly informed Luftwaffe Headquarters about the real situation - with the result that he was transferred to a staff position in Berlin.
In his new role, Baumbach worked with the development of new anti-shipping weapons like the Hs 239 guided bomb and the Mistel (Misteltoe) composite bomber. On 15 Nov 1944, Baumbach was promoted Lieutenant-Colonel and held the post of 'General of the Bomber Force'.
Eventually he became also responsible for a German 'Kamikaze' unit which had been dreamed up by Hanna Reitsch and the SS under Skorzeny. The aircaft in question was a piloted version of the V-1, the Fi 103 R Reichenberg which should be flown by volunteers, 'the most fanatical of the fanatics, the fieriest of the believers'. But when Baumbach talked to these volunteers, it turned out that they did not know really to what they had been committed to. They thought they were to take part in some special operation, like the rescue of Mussolini, and would get a medal afterwards. Baumbach went to Himmler who ultimately accepted Baumbach's arguments and the suicide unit was disbanded.
In January 45, now a Colonel, Baumbach realized that further fighting was futile. He wrote a letter to Göring declaring his point of view, the letter ended with the following: "I should be an infernal coward if I could not screw up the little moral courage required to do with my voice what thousands of my comrades have done with their blood. As I do not wish to be running around as a marionette, I hereby place my rank and the orders I have won in battle at your disposal." Göring however pretendend to never having received that letter and Baumbach remained in service.
Together with his friend Albert Speer he now counteracted the system, especially Hitler's 'Demolition Order', from within. As Baumbach happened to be in Hamburg when the British aproaced the town, he convinced Gauleiter Kaufmann to surrender the city.
After Hitler's suicide, Baumbach became a member of the last gouverment of the Third Reich, under Hitler's successor Dönitz. After the German capitulation, Baumbach was brought to England. He spent nearly six months in an English interrogation camp. He was told that he would be charged as a war criminal on the ground that he had fired on shipwrecked people. After unending cross-examination and investigation Baumbach was able to prove conclusively that throughout the war neither he nor any unit under his command had committed any violations of the Hague Convention.
After his release, he worked together with Harvard historian Bruce C. Hopper on studies about the Second World War. In 1948 he emigrated with his wife and son to South America and became technical adviser to industrial firms. Baumbach's ideas about the future development of armaments and war in the air made him one of the accepted international experts on air strategy.
In the Argentine Baumbach pursued research into the problems of remote-controlled flight. On 20 October 1953, during an experiment in a Lancaster bomber he crashed and was drowned in the Rio de la Plata. Baumbach was eventually buried in his hometown Cloppenburg.
from an expanded wiki-europ article
Anti-shipping specialist and Bomber General.
Werner Baumbach was born on 27 December 1916 in Cloppenburg, Germany. While still going to college he flew gliders and was admitted as a cadet to the Luftwaffe in 1936. In 1938 he was promoted to lieutenant and became an instructor for instrument flying.
At the beginning of the war he flew bomber missions with KG 30 over Poland and received the Iron Cross 2nd Class after a successful raid against Warsaw airport. After the Polish campaign, KG 30 became the first unit to be equipped with Ju 88 and relocated to airfields at the North Sea. In March 40 Baumbach's unit made the first dive-bombing attacks in the Ju 88 against the British Fleet in Firth of Forth and Scapa Flow, although these attacks accomplished little.
During operation Weserübung Baumbach flew anti-shipping missions over Norway. On 19 April 40 he damaged the French cruiser 'Emile Bertin' with his Ju 88 over Andalsnes, earning him the Iron Cross 1st Class. Since High Command eventually assumed she had been sunk (which was not the case), Baumbach was awarded the Knight's Cross for the sinking.
During the French campaign Baumbach flew anti-AA missions over Holland in preparation for German paradrops and attacked the beaches during the Dunkirk evacuation. In June 1940 he was selected for a special courier mission, flying from Berlin to Tokyo, via Moscow. He returned to KG 30 after the Battle of Britain. The unit's mission now was the blockade of Great Britain but it flew also bombing missions against London during the winter of 40/41. During one of these missions Baumbach's Ju 88 lost an engine over the British capital but he managed to crash-land it on Dutch soil, Baumbach being injured in the process. After returning to his unit in January 1941, Baumbach dropped mines in the Themse estuary but soon began to attack allied shipping in the Atlantic. By 14 July 1941 Baumbach had sunk about 240 000 tons of Allied shipping and was awarded the 20th Oak Leaves in the German armed forces. On 20 July 41, Baumbach became commander of KG 30.
As an elite anti-shipping unit, KG 30 was sent to hot spots over the Black Sea, the Mediteranean and again over the Atlantic in early 1942. In August 42, KG 30 started to attack the Murmansk convoys from Stavanger, Norway. During that year, Baumbach had added another 60 000 tons of tonnage sunk, earning him the Swords to his Knight's Cross. Baumbach was the first German bomber pilot to receive this award. Baumbach had by now become a Major and his unit was once more transferred to the Mediteranean, tasked with attacking Allied shipping near Algers during operation 'Torch'. But the Luftwaffe organisation on the Sicily air fields was not up to such a major task, crews, planes, fuel and mechanics existed only on paper. Baumbach frankly informed Luftwaffe Headquarters about the real situation - with the result that he was transferred to a staff position in Berlin.
In his new role, Baumbach worked with the development of new anti-shipping weapons like the Hs 239 guided bomb and the Mistel (Misteltoe) composite bomber. On 15 Nov 1944, Baumbach was promoted Lieutenant-Colonel and held the post of 'General of the Bomber Force'.
Eventually he became also responsible for a German 'Kamikaze' unit which had been dreamed up by Hanna Reitsch and the SS under Skorzeny. The aircaft in question was a piloted version of the V-1, the Fi 103 R Reichenberg which should be flown by volunteers, 'the most fanatical of the fanatics, the fieriest of the believers'. But when Baumbach talked to these volunteers, it turned out that they did not know really to what they had been committed to. They thought they were to take part in some special operation, like the rescue of Mussolini, and would get a medal afterwards. Baumbach went to Himmler who ultimately accepted Baumbach's arguments and the suicide unit was disbanded.
In January 45, now a Colonel, Baumbach realized that further fighting was futile. He wrote a letter to Göring declaring his point of view, the letter ended with the following: "I should be an infernal coward if I could not screw up the little moral courage required to do with my voice what thousands of my comrades have done with their blood. As I do not wish to be running around as a marionette, I hereby place my rank and the orders I have won in battle at your disposal." Göring however pretendend to never having received that letter and Baumbach remained in service.
Together with his friend Albert Speer he now counteracted the system, especially Hitler's 'Demolition Order', from within. As Baumbach happened to be in Hamburg when the British aproaced the town, he convinced Gauleiter Kaufmann to surrender the city.
After Hitler's suicide, Baumbach became a member of the last gouverment of the Third Reich, under Hitler's successor Dönitz. After the German capitulation, Baumbach was brought to England. He spent nearly six months in an English interrogation camp. He was told that he would be charged as a war criminal on the ground that he had fired on shipwrecked people. After unending cross-examination and investigation Baumbach was able to prove conclusively that throughout the war neither he nor any unit under his command had committed any violations of the Hague Convention.
After his release, he worked together with Harvard historian Bruce C. Hopper on studies about the Second World War. In 1948 he emigrated with his wife and son to South America and became technical adviser to industrial firms. Baumbach's ideas about the future development of armaments and war in the air made him one of the accepted international experts on air strategy.
In the Argentine Baumbach pursued research into the problems of remote-controlled flight. On 20 October 1953, during an experiment in a Lancaster bomber he crashed and was drowned in the Rio de la Plata. Baumbach was eventually buried in his hometown Cloppenburg.
- Thread starter
- #158
Lucky13
Forum Mascot
Thanks again Micdrow..! Much appreciated! Wonder if Banak, where I./KG30 were based is the same as Banak Flyplass/Airport.....that's waaaayyyyy up north! Guttorm!!!!
- Thread starter
- #159
Lucky13
Forum Mascot
Thanks a million Erich! Just saw your post after that I had posted mine.... I'll start another thread on Baumbach '88 shortly...
If I only had the luck of finding an 1/48 A-4 before my three week holiday in Sweden...
I'll start another thread on Baumbach '88 shortly...If I only had the luck of finding an 1/48 A-4 before my three week holiday in Sweden...
Erich
the old Sage
write Knut L a note and send him my greetings bud, we haven't chatted together for quite some time now-years, in fact knowing the north like he does he would not surprise me he has a photo of Baumbach and his Ju 88 and crew............you could of course ask and tell him what you are planning, at least he could try and get you in touch with another historian/researcher
