**** DONE: 1/72 Lockheed P-38H Lightning - Heavy Hitters II GB

Discussion in '#18 Heavy Hitters II' started by parsifal, May 6, 2013.

  1. parsifal

    parsifal Well-Known Member

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    #1 parsifal, May 6, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 14, 2013
    My next build for relates to GB-18, an is different for me. it is not australian, not RAN, and has no direct connection to my own personal experiences. Moreover, i was moved to build this as my GB entry after the reading the online biography of John Tilley, a flier who flew for the 431st "Hades" squadron of the 475th FG from november 1943 until the end of the war. He was not the biggest or meanest of the fliers, but as a man i found i could relate to the way he thought and the way he spoke. Even though this particular mount is not john tilleys, i would like to dedicate it to his memory.
    Entry Details

    Lockheed P-38H of Maj Thomas Buchanan, 431st FS of the 475th FG, V Fighter command, V Air force, United States Army Air Force. Heavy hitters of WWII (well one of them)
    User name: Parsifal
    Name: Michael
    Category: 1, Beginner
    Kit: Airfix 1/72 "Aircraft of the aces" P-38H Lightning
    Scale: 1/72.
    Accessories: None at this stage

    john Tilleys story is contained in this biography

    Secrets of a P-38 Ace. John Tilley's electrifying story


    Some background of 431st Sqn in WWII and how it has a strong australian connection can be found here

    5th Air Force USAAF in Australia 1942 - 1945


    An image of the kit

    at this stage i am thinking i will [aint the tail art myself. im not sure if i want to extemporise the gun aramanet


    Did the p-38 carry HVAR rockets?

    A big thanks to wayne for gettng me the build instructions, which were missing from my copy of the kit.
     

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  2. Wayne Little

    Wayne Little Well-Known Member

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    You're welcome Sir!

    look forward to your build...
     
  3. meatloaf109

    meatloaf109 Well-Known Member

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    IIRC, the late marks of the -38 carried the HVAR's on a weird "tree" like mount. 3 or 5, can't remember exactly.
     
  4. parsifal

    parsifal Well-Known Member

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    hmm, will have to look at that. The problem I have, among many really, is that I dont know too much about this aircraft. it has always fascinated me, but Ive never really studied it. Any information you guys might have, like weapons loadouts and aftermarket kits, will be happily accepted.

    For me the research is one of the best bits. Lets face it, Im not the best at this, though I enjoy making models a lot. Eyesight is the biggest proble,.....

    Anyway, Ive spent the night researching cockpit details.....colours and kits mostly. Ive ocated a 1/72 kit by Eduard that looks pretty good, and not too pricey either. Cockpits are a bit of a waste for 1/72.....you dont see much of them after the cocpit is buttoned up, but I still like doing them

    The cockpit Ive found is for a P-38J . Is ther much difference between the H and the J

    If I did get the kit, im thinking I will need to sand back the raised detail of the airfix IP. Its just not right and some really weird looking raised bits that I think aremeant to be like a compass or a reflector sight. Either way, the Eduard IP doesnt seem to have the same detailing s the Kit.

    HobbyEasy | P-38J Lightning
     
  5. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

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    Good one Michael. And as already mentioned, yes, some P-38 units used HVARS, on the 'Christmas tree' racks under the wings. I think I have some drawings or pics, and I have the 1/48th scale parts to show the arrangement - leave it with me and I'll see what I can dig out.
     
  6. Crimea_River

    Crimea_River Well-Known Member

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    Just had time to quickly post these. I have actual photos somewhere if you need them. 5 rockets per side.

    38rocketClus.gif
    aef3d-cl.jpg
     
  7. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

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    Good one Andy. Here's the general arrangement drawing from the Mushroom book on the P-38 J and L.
     

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  8. parsifal

    parsifal Well-Known Member

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    Brilliant, thanks guys
     
  9. N4521U

    N4521U Well-Known Member

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    Oooooooo time for some scratch building eh?
     
  10. Vic Balshaw

    Vic Balshaw Well-Known Member

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    Nice one Michael and good to have you back in a GB. I've the Panda 1/48 kit sitting in the sidelines waiting a GB so I'll watch this one with interest.
     
  11. parsifal

    parsifal Well-Known Member

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    Ive been thinking about this build all day....when I should be working, B*gger it, this is far more important!!!. ive decided to purchase the Eduard PE kit for the P-38J, which will probably have some differences to the H. Being the lazy SOB that I am, I was hoping that there might be an officianado on P-38s to tell me differences between the H and the J subtypes. I can find out for myself, but I thought I might ask first.


    I also decided to purchase the HVAR kit that I did manage to source for this kit. Might involve some minor drilling of the underwing area , but no drama.

    Ther are two effects that arise from these decisions, apart from me getting into trouble for spending money (things are tight on the ponderosa at the moment). Firstly ther wil be a bit of a delay whilst I wait for the cockpit stuff to arrive. No big deal, should arrive (from Japan) in about 7-10 days. The second are the construction mods i will need to make. Already mentioned the changes I will need for the underwing rockets.......I also want the kit to have either LR tanks or a bombload in the inboard lug points (Im pretty sure that I have seen a photo of this kinda bombload....bombs or fuel tanks inboard, rockets outboar....this is a heavy hitters GB....feel free to tell me Im wrong...better to get it right than have a model that is a joke because I didnt know what I was doing). I am pretty sure I will have to sand back the ridges and other elements of the kit in the IP as they will not work with the PE sheet Im ordering. Im very impressed with the Eduard offering for this scale, and think it will be worth the expense and trouble, because it really does set the model off. I was happy with the Eduard kit i put into my Sea Fury, so hopefully this will work a treat better than my first PE attempt (only my second go guys)

    Anyway, going to Canberra this weekend, and will try and score some new brushes and correct paints to do this project. Airbrush got stripped down and serviced....compressor and gun are primed and ready, and I cant wait......
     
  12. Vic Balshaw

    Vic Balshaw Well-Known Member

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  13. parsifal

    parsifal Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Vic, and everyone. I can get the HVAR rockets fairly easily, but the christmas tree mounts are a different matter.

    im thinking I could probably use old sprue to make the mounts, or possibly even small gauge Brass rod. File it flat either side, Bend it to shape using a vice and ball peen hammer, braze up the cossmembers and when its all nice and cool glue it to the wings/

    Another method might be to use heat very carefully to bend sprue or similar into shape. Heat is dangerous I know, but would be nowhere near the model. i might have to have a few goes at it I guess. Its going to be pretty small

    I might even have a couple of mountings left over from my venom build. They are a different mount, but I think it would be fairly easy to modify them to look like the P-38 christmas tree....

    Any suggestion or tips before I give myself third degree burns???,
     
  14. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

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    Plastic strip and rod might be better Michael, although it's a complex shape to fabricate in a small scale. As the P-38H was an 'interim' model, before the externally different J and L were introduced, I'm not sure the HVAR multiple mounts were used, but then I don't know much about the theater, or period, the model is from, so no problem.
     
  15. T Bolt

    T Bolt Well-Known Member

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    I have the Detail in Scale for the P-38 at home. I'll take a look tonight and see what it has to say about the differences between the H and J
     
  16. Airframes

    Airframes Benevolens Magister

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    Most obvious external difference is the engine nacelles, with the later 'J' model having the 'chin' radiators, unlike the smooth, streamlined frontal cowlings of the 'H'.
    I think also that the wing was strengthened, with hard points added, on the 'J' onwards, along with the speed brakes. I'm not sure without checking, but I think the 'H' had the hard points inboard of each engine only, between nacelles and fuselage pod, where drop tanks were normally mounted.
     
  17. parsifal

    parsifal Well-Known Member

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    That would mean I should not fit my HVAR rockets. The kit has impressions of inboard underwing ordinance....Im not sure if they are tanks or bombs (thats embarrassing I know) , but better to not fit the rockets. B*gger

    This is kinda consistent with Tilleys bio. He doesnt mention rocket attacks until after the 431st moved to the Phillipines. he does however imply long range missions and bombing runs whilst in NG with the H, so I think it will still qualify. Either that or i should attempt a conversion of the H to the J standard, something Im not at all confident to try....
     
  18. T Bolt

    T Bolt Well-Known Member

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    Had a look at the Detail and Scale books and although there are no cockpit pictures of the H and J, there are pics of the E and L. There are some differences, mostly with control panel instruments and boxes on the side wall, but in 1/72 scale I don't think it will be noticeable. If you want to add more bombs now that you won't be putting on the HVAR's I found a pic of a P-38 with 3 pylons in each wing between the engine and the fuselage. The caption says it was a field modification used on a few aircraft. The aircraft in the pic is a later mod with the big under nose radiators, but it didn't say it wasn't used on earlier models so it's possible and would make for an impressive bomb load.
     
  19. Vic Balshaw

    Vic Balshaw Well-Known Member

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    Just pulled these out of the Osprey Book Michael, they may help.

    P-38 H  J  Drawing 2.jpg

    P-38 H  J  Drawing 1.jpg
     
  20. parsifal

    parsifal Well-Known Member

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    Ive made a bit of a start tonite (but not much....sorry i will have to go slowly with this due to a lack of knowledge) after getting back from Canberra. I brought back some 0.5mm drills for the pin vice and started to drill through the IP dials . My method for doing IP dials has changed a bit. Not that i am any sort of expert on this, but I do what works for me, and lord knows ive had my share of failures on cockpit detailing.

    Basically my method of doing cockpit dials is as follows. i carefully drill the gauges out using the finest drill i can find. Then I put the base coat and any dry brush finishes onto the IP face. then, I use a new fine brush to push semi dry paint into the dial holes from the back of the IP, (sometimes I use white, but on this one it will probably be back paint, since that is the dominant "dial colour" . If Im feeling lucky I might try and get a white ring and a black centre, simply by doing a white initial coat from the back, and then a black layer, not pushed as far into the dial hole. Remember, though these holes are just 0.5mm diameter, so theres not much to work with, My paint work "in the hole" only takes a few minutes to dry, because I work in acrylic), I seal the back using a drop of CA, Next I tun the IP over and put a small drop of acrylic clear over the gauge to try and get the image of a dial face on the front. The intended look is dial with t a glass cover.

    So far Ive managed to do this in testing, but yet to be as a successful as I would like in final application. Ive had a some partially okay finishes, but Im just not quite where I want to be.

    Somuch for the method, but now for the colour scheme of the IP. Most of the modelling reviews recommend cockpit greem with some dark grey or drab olive dry brushing for the raised bits. But a few talk about zinc chromate and one guy, who seems to know what hes doing produced this rendition. What are peoples views on the way that Cockpits and IPs in particular for the P-38 should be finished? Is this guy right????? Or should I stick with my gut and go cockpit green with a slightly darker dry brushing for the raised bits?

    Have a lolk at his alleged colour detail of a P-38 cockpit and let me know what you think?

    Revell 4749: Lockheed P-38J | Large Scale Planes
     

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