GB.19 Aircraft Nose Art Introduction

[meatloaf109]

The way I recall the story is that somebody in the 2nd AVG saw a "Life" magazine about the P-40's that the British were using in N.A. and thought the shark mouth was pretty cool, so he painted on his, then several others decided it was neat and did theirs also. When Chennault heard about it he initially ordered them removed, until Madam Kai-shek commented on how they would strike terror into the Japanese airmen. Chennault then decided that they could stay, and the marking spread to the 1st and 3rd AVG.
So one could argue for "Unofficial" at first, and then "official" later.

 

[N4521U]

As I was thinking, there was no "set" pattern to them as most have some minor and real differences in shape and size.

Air show? that would fall in with GB30, Post war / New lease on life, IMHO. Even ANG.

Yah think?

 

[Vic Balshaw]

Good, now we have some debate going!! How about we change the title to 'Aircraft Art'.

Under this title we could say that anything goes as long as it is not related to specific squadron colours, badges, identification markings or anniversary markings/livery, and would exclude specially applied commemorative, celebratory or anniversary liveries as well as aerobatic team or individual aerobatic aircraft display colours.

Any advance on these thoughts!

 

[N4521U]

What a mouth full.

Any military aircraft with Personal art or decoration?
Dragons, Pelicans and kah-nig-its!

 

[Rogi]

So..now the aircraft has to have been involved in combat? Just to clarify, with these markings?

Cause it is still unclear to me, I've originally planed for an airshow bird because of the nose art factor, even a retiring from the services bird. If we're going to do just one type let us know please and if it is going to be more linear in the idea then please clarify further

combat-personal, no official dilly dally just personal marking nose art, something like that

When originally given "Nose Art" as the example That opened up a lot of options that fit the bill if we are limiting it to a specific time period or a specific item of interest to spice the build up I'd love to know before the build starts I'm regularly obsessing about G.B.s then get un-clear info and fudge most my entries lol I'm like Big Bird guest visiting in on Bananas in Pajamas.

So now Su-22 Iranian Shark bird is out, and....most of my pups are out for this one lol Su-7 with the crazy shark mouth scheme, Phantom FGR MK 2 sharkmouth, ima find something in my pile that fits hehehe

hmmm naked lady Russian Nieuport 17 birds ah ha! hmmm...I could even sneak in a Korean F-86

 

[Vic Balshaw]

Sorry Igor, I seem to be confusing the issue somewhat, believe me I'm not trying to restrict the choices open to folks, I'm just trying to find out what the benchmarks should be before we start the GB.

 

[meatloaf109]

Good, now we have some debate going!! How about we change the title to 'Aircraft Art'.

Under this title we could say that anything goes as long as it is not related to specific squadron colours, badges, identification markings or anniversary markings/livery, and would exclude specially applied commemorative, celebratory or anniversary liveries as well as aerobatic team or individual aerobatic aircraft display colours.

Any advance on these thoughts!

Right!

 

[Lucky13]

But then again, isn't that a Group/Squadron marking etc.?

The sharkmouth that is...

Here's another one.....would a 'Tigermeet' bird fit the bill?

 

[N4521U]

Just a for instance above. My HH-60B shown. It was the squadron Hack, the crew were given free reign on decorating, just that one helicopter. HS-4, the Black Knights.

So my understanding is still any serving military aircraft, any era, decorated with non standard nose, tail, or fuselage decoration. That is my interpretation.

Still, IMHO.

 

[destrozas]

for my part i was offline for a while to bridge some issues and as you know I have suffered loss recently, and am not able haqber not have had the strength to do anything but be with my family.

and turned the topic and I get active, "art-nose" as I understand it is any unofficial flagship aircraft in WWII following is the best example is in the books squadron of art-nose signal that reaches our days being informal or not.

for this GB I have the A / B -26 invader in 1945, a p-47 d-15 42-75719

for 30 Gb I would include the tigermeet or memorial, as well as p which are painted for racing, or individuals that restore,

I would put it this plane in this more than the GB29

 

[Rogi]

for my part i was offline for a while to bridge some issues and as you know I have suffered loss recently, and am not able haqber not have had the strength to do anything but be with my family.

and turned the topic and I get active, "art-nose" as I understand it is any unofficial flagship aircraft in WWII following is the best example is in the books squadron of art-nose signal that reaches our days being informal or not.

for this GB I have the A / B -26 invader in 1945, a p-47 d-15 42-75719

for 30 Gb I would include the tigermeet or memorial, as well as p which are painted for racing, or individuals that restore,

I would put it this plane in this more than the GB29

I was originally planning to do this plane, the Iranian Su-22 with shark mouth motif, it is an authorized gov. version that they showed off at an air show, so if air shows are out we wouldn't be able to do it

I had her envisioned in a 1/144 scale


I'm all for clarification but I'd love to get everything clarified about a month or two in advance before the GB starts so we have prelim ideas on the scheme. Yeses and No to what we can and can't implement into the GB. Examples would be useful too and cool

 

[fubar57]

I'm thinking that "Personal" markings might be the way to look at this, something that says "this is my aircraft".

Geo

 

[parsifal]

Good, now we have some debate going!! How about we change the title to 'Aircraft Art'.

Under this title we could say that anything goes as long as it is not related to specific squadron colours, badges, identification markings or anniversary markings/livery, and would exclude specially applied commemorative, celebratory or anniversary liveries as well as aerobatic team or individual aerobatic aircraft display colours.

Any advance on these thoughts!

I get the difficulties Vic. Contradicting my own previous posts, Im not sure that excluding all "suthorised" artwork is all that necessary. What are we trying to bring out here? I would think its the flamboyance, the appeal, of aircraft artwork. Just because its "authorised" does not necessarily make it outside what the general objective is.

I would suggest that we more or less adopt what youve said here (but can the wording be simplified...its really complicated when you read it), but we add something along the lines of allowing "authorised" artwork only after such artwork has been submitted and approved by one or more of the judges.

An example of the type of thing I was thnking are the "Black Knight" chevron insignia on the tails of 805 sqn A-4s in the lat 70's. Like most Australian aircraft,fully sanctioned, so techniclally not allowed, but I think worth allowing (on a case by case basis), because its still artwork, even if its "official.

 

[Vic Balshaw]

Not easy to simplify but maybe if we go back to what Andy posted a couple of days ago and take on questions from there.

This one will be tough to put boundaries around. When I brought it up, the vision was that the entries be military aircraft, any era, with flamboyant personal or squadron markings anywhere on the aircraft, so not necessarily limited to the nose. German squadron badges, taken alone, would not qualify, nor would the identifying triangles, squares, or circles on American aircraft be considered "art". I would include sharkmouths, large wespen, and squadron markings of this nature. The fancy airshow paint schemes would not qualify as Vic says.

Fellow judges, your input may be needed.

 

[N4521U]

This one will be tough to put boundaries around. When I brought it up, the vision was that the entries be military aircraft, any era, with flamboyant personal or squadron markings anywhere on the aircraft, so not necessarily limited to the nose. German squadron badges, taken alone, would not qualify, nor would the identifying triangles, squares, or circles on American aircraft be considered "art". I would include sharkmouths, large wespen, and squadron markings of this nature. The fancy airshow paint schemes would not qualify as Vic says.

Yes............... This!

 

[parsifal]

I read that as being that we can do official squadron insignia and the like as aircraft art. Crimea seems to have nailed it i think (no disrespect Vic)

 

[Vic Balshaw]

None taken Michael.

 

[meatloaf109]

O.k., here is my thing, (and this is not to cause disqualification of his entry!) but the entry of a Bf-109G-6 into "heavy hitters" is kind of strange. I thought it was a ground attack idea.
So, if that is allowed, then "Nose art' should allow the shark mouth of the AVG. Just sayin'.
Not that I intend to enter one. I am saving that for "aircraft in foreign service", I just wanted to clarify the ideas.

 

[parsifal]

if im reading the discussion right, thats pretty much where we ended up. An AVG sharkmouth qualifies, even its "official". its artwork, its original, its unique, so as i read this discussion, it would be okay to enter.

 

[N4521U]

And TaDa.............. today is the first day of GB19...... no entries yet, or is it Aug 1 in Oz first?