**** DONE: 1/48 P-47M - Aircraft Nose Art GB.

[T Bolt]

Andy, to my knowledge the taller, rounded front fillet only appeared on the P-47N, The lower straight fillet appearing on the P-47D-30 P-47D-40 and the P-47M. That being said that picture defiantly looks like a P-47N type fillet. I know reps from Republic worked closely with the 56th FG. so maybe they were trying out the "N" fillet with the 56th. Only speculation though as I have never seen or heard of anything specific about the fillet. I'll have a look through my books and see if I can come up with anything.

 

[Airframes]

Looks like Glenn is on the right track.
According to the late Roger Freeman, probably the authority on the 8th AF, fin fillets were installed on the unit's P-47Ms, 'in the field', at Boxted, in the early Spring of 1945. A photo in the Osprey 'Elite Series - 56th Fighter Group', by Roger, shows P-47M, 44- 21131, code UN-X, a camouflaged aircraft like your subject Andy, with a bare metal fillet similar to that fitted to the later 'N' model - that is, with the higher, curved, leading edge where it meets the fuselage spine. The rear joint, angled where it meets the vertical fin, is also visible.

 

[T Bolt]

Thanks Terry, saves me a search through my library.

 

[Crimea_River]

Excellent info guys, thanks. That lends a lot of support to the idea that Fireball had a similar setup. I include a detail of Paul's picture below and a further one of Fireball flying behind "Ole-Miss". Paul's photo is strong evidence and the second one forces one to interpret what's in the background through "Ole-Miss"'s canopy (see arrow) but it strongly suggests to me to that "Fireball" had a bare aluminum N-style fillet. If anyone has more info, chuck it on the pile!

 

[Airframes]

I agree Andy and that's just what the fillet on UN-X looks like. It's also visible, albeit not very clearly, on other photos, although it seems not all aircraft had the fillet - probably a progressive thing, fitted as time allowed, by Flights/Squadrons.
I'll scan and post the side-on shot tomorrow, so that you can see the joint at the fin.

 

[Crimea_River]

That would be most excellent my friend.

 

[Airframes]

Just realised it's already tomorrow here, so I've scanned the pic, in case I forget when it's properly tomorrow!
I'm afraid it doesn't show up very well in the scan, as the original half-tone was rather 'thin' to start with. I've altered the contrast in the enlarged section, and the curve of the fillet at the leading edge can just be discerned. The shape of the joint with the fin, in the bare metal, can also be seen.
I think I might have a fillet the same shape, from the Academy kit I built some years back. If you think it might be useful, let me know, and I'll see if the part(s) are still in the box, with the other unused bits.

 

[Crimea_River]

Thanks a bunch Terry. Fortunately, Tamiya's 'M' has plenty of parts and I'm all set to do any of the possible fillet options. I just wanted to be sure I picked the right one.

The next question will be around the potential for a black cowl band but that will be the subject of another post on another day......

 

[T Bolt]

Andy, I found this in Zemke's Wolfpack by William N. Hess. Of all the P-47M's in the book this is the only one showing the taller fillet so I don't think it was a very common modification

 

[Crimea_River]

Great stuff Glenn, thanks. I agree that the majority of pics of these aircraft show the more common straight fillet and some with none. I still think I'll do the aluminum fillet on Fireball though.

 

[Wurger]

 

[rochie]

proof taller fillets were fitted to M models andy and in the profiles the artist has painted the taller fillet on fireball !

pic from squadron/signal walkaround P-47
profiles from warpaint special 001 P-47 thunderbolt

 

[Crimea_River]

Cheers Karl. More evidence to support the case. The only question that remains is, how did the profile producers come up with the painted fillet when the known photos of Fireball show bare aluminum? I'll trust the pictures.

 

[prem895]

Great digging guy's

 

[fubar57]

Just caught up the last 3 pages. I've got 20 some odd books on the -47. I'll start looking.

Geo

 

[Wurger]

 

[Crimea_River]

OK, about those black cowls. Let's do a bit of a summary of what's out there.

First off, George Bostiwick's rig evidently has a black band around the cowl as can be seen in this colour pic, same one as I put up in post 3.

It is clear in some photos that not all 63rd FS Jugs had these bands and yet some others, unfortunately in black and white appear to suggest that some aircraft other than Bostwick's had it. BTW, some of what I'm offering up here is discussed here: P47 Heaven :: P-47M Colours 63FS/56FG

Let's take a look at Chuck McBath's Dottie Dee II, same one as Karl posted in #89. Here's a pic of the nose:

To me, there's a distinct difference in the cowl colour and the fuselage behind it, the colour purported to be dark blue. However, there's an even darker colour around the nose art that stands out against the cowl. So, is the cowl black or not? Some say no while others suggest he cowl is flat black and the border around the nose art is gloss black. I'm leaning toward the latter theory.

Now, let's take a look at Fireball. Here's Kuhn standing in front of his aircraft. At first glance the picture does not appear to offer as much of a clue as the one above but take a look at the shades to the left of Kuhn's head. There appears to be a definite difference between the cowl and the cowl flaps and the fuselage looks the same as the cowl flaps. I thought at first that the light might be hitting the cowl flaps differently if they were open but they are in fact closed, so the surfaces in this area would be at the same angle. Also, take a look at this same pic, albeit darker and more pixelated, that Bill put up in Post 17. Did Fireball have a Black cowl?

Here's another interesting shot in which Fireball can be seen behind "Ole Miss Lib". This is the same pic I made a detail of a few posts back.

On the plane in the foreground, if you ignore the weathered panels and look along the top quarter of the fuselage, there appear to be no differences in colour, suggesting that the cowl was the same colour as the fuselage. Now do the same on Fireball in the background and notice how much darker the cowl is than the area behind it. It's also a lot darker than the cowl on "Ole Miss Lib". Here's a close-up detail to show what I mean:

Personally, I'm leaning toward Fireball having a black cowl. What do you guys think?

 

[ozhawk40]

Could just be a fresh coat of top colour CR, or the way is was painted/ different paint process (cowl painted off ship - I would suspect this due to the lower colour demarcation), or it was pinched off another OD P-47, or anything aft of the cowl flaps got a regular wash down with avgas to remove oil. Lots of possibilities Go with what you think. It will turn out great regardless.

Cheers

Peter

 

[T Bolt]

Andy, my my guess is that wile some of those Jugs differently look like they have a flat black cowl, I don't think Fire Ball does. The variation of shade of the cowl flaps could just be because they are separate pieces of aluminum, and wile they are fully closed, they still are not at the same exact angle to the camera as the rest of the cowl and could be reflecting the light slightly differently. I'd go with a cowl the same color as the fuselage and if you want, lighten up the paint for the cowl flaps just a touch for a little variation.

 

[Crimea_River]

Thanks for the feedback guys. Good points.